Has Windows 10 redeemed Microsoft?

[chrisj1968]

Either in small part, such as UI changes, desktop changes or in the bigger picture, Has MSFT redeemed itself? be honest here. look at the big picture. Personally I don't think so. why? because while it is a vast improvement over 8/8.1, from even a basic artistic point of view, meaning the look, design of the UI, icons, just on that front, Win10 fell short. I posted Many threads during preview builds based upon personal use AND from screenshots. I think the best UI design and icon set was Vista.

The way Windows 10 runs, it runs pretty good. I'm a gamer so I look at this from a gamer perspective. What MSFT seems to have murdered was my ability to play my old favorite games. I'm stuck with GRAW/GRAW2 right now and ARMA2 as well. They run better and I've always been a pro DX12 proponent. But some of the old simpler games I enjoyed in the past DO NOT work anymore. Ghost Recon 2001/2002 time frame. nothing I can do will get this game to run. It bothers me because all the way up to windows 10, even during the preview build days, it ran. Now Windows 10 broke it.

The new look

the OS looks good in terms of colors but when you look past this, the OS isn't really all that great. In past iterations of windows, I noticed that the look of the OS was degraded from Vista to 10. I could tell that some good artistic work was done on icons, the themes.

The battle for supremacy

We now have with 10, a battle between the control panel on the one hand then the new settings interface on the other. It feels like we lost some control over our OS. example? updates. I somehow got stuck with the Home version with the update route from win 8.1. however, the update feature "forces" users to update whether the update destroys the windows install or not. What's the only remedy? you have to buy the PRO version to be able to use the drop down menu to be notified of new updates and whether to install them. MSFT screwed this up badly. I've tried registry hacks to create the menu for getting notified of updates and deciding which to install if a bad one gets released, it does happen. these hacks never worked. Home edition seems more like a preschool toy version. Shameful. I'm under this impression that, MSFT is saying, "you get what you pay for." MSFT should have known better than to release an edition of windows that's crippled.

I'm sad to think this but, I'd expected much more. I was so hopeful with Windows 10. I don't think MSFT has anything left in the tank to redeem itself. As for popularizing Windows 10, I've only seen 1 commercial for this OS. the only good quality of Win10 is the DX12 stack but I'm beginning to think that, it breaks my old titles that I enjoy to play.

I'm just a simple gamer. I do however like edge. a massive improvement over IE but there really isn't anything compelling to tell me that this OS has redeemed MSFT. Some might ask, "why should MSFT have to redeem itself? the last 2 OS's, 8 and 8.1 flopped. the windows team was fired, a new team brought in and we hoped. But in the BIG picture I don't think this OS will redeem Windows. MSFT has turned into UBISOFT. UBISOFT destroyed Ghost Recon and are now hoping to create GR wildlands in hopes to win back loyal players.

Final thoughts

I think while Windows 10 is better than 8/8.1, it doesn't impress enough to think that Microsoft will ever be the once great OS king it was. It may stay on top because of the lack of a competitor to challenge MSFT to build an OS that is feature rich and something that will win loyal back. the only good thing about 10 is DX12. Cortana doesn't impress me. I seriously think that those of us who got boned with the home version upgrade were given a half baked OS that literally took my update control from me.

please know this is simply my opinion of the OS now its been close to two weeks out. But after being able to kick the tires, Windows 10 leaves a lot to be desired for $119. I'll have to look into trying out the .iso file I have, hopefully it s the pro version that I went after and that it works. I'm just disappointed. I gave feedback like mad in regards to features and icons and the overall look. I'm bummed is all.

[Yusuf M. Veteran]

I didn't like the overall look of Windows 10 at first but it has grown on me. I think it looks more consistent than Windows 8.1. And I like the direction that Microsoft is going. Blurring the lines between mobile and desktop isn't a bad thing. Also, I'm excited about DirectX 12 and the improvements it'll bring over DX11.

Anyway, my only gripe at the moment is the use of legacy icons. I wish Microsoft would replace every single icon with an updated version. Either that or allow people to use custom icons on an OS-wide level. I think custom icon packs for Windows would be very popular.

[c.grz]

Has Windows 10 redeemed Microsoft?  No, they never needed redeeming.

[shockz]

I don't think it redeemed anyone's opinions who haven't upgraded to 8 and are still on XP or 7. Saying that though, modern/universal apps aren't going away, so people are realizing that it's either upgrade or be left in the dust.

I have to say that tablet mode is extremely frustrating, and until Microsoft fixes the variety of problems associated with it, they'll get grief and a bad rep, something they can't afford.

[Dashel]

The games you listed are on the official Win10 compat list.  Like you said, they were working in preview so if you've been through a few upgrade cycles you're probably overdue for a reset or dealing with a local issue.

Its unfair to count the Win8 debacle twice.

 

[jaffar]

The new look

Flat design is the trend everywhere not only in Windows

No one is using eye candy design anymore

[Quillz]

I think the best UI design and icon set was Vista.

For me, I'd probably go with Win2000. Had a very consistent look and feel, and the UI was relatively simple and unobtrusive. 

[123456789A]

Didn't know they really needed redemption but yes Windows 10 is a vast improvement over Windows 8 if that's what you mean.

Is it perfect? Far from it, but it's getting there. Windows 7 was about as "perfect" as a desktop-only OS gets but everything Windows 8 and onward was created for a new generation of devices, so there will be some issues going through a big transition like that.

[chrisj1968]

proof of my example of the failed update system. Home edition, you can't prevent your system from downloading this crap. Home edition is the "you get the crap edition" and if we release an update that jacks up your system, screw you, too bad. 

For me, I'd probably go with Win2000. Had a very consistent look and feel, and the UI was relatively simple and unobtrusive. 

I liked Vistas 3d icons and dark black theme for easier on eye strain. They should have kept the control panel and redesigned it for the UI continuity. wouldn't be that hard. I think I'm relegated to going back to Win 8.1, the oem version that came with my Toshiba. I'll run with this install until it gets nuked and go back.

[+BudMan MVC]

"Anyway, my only gripe at the moment is the use of legacy icons."

That is your gripe?  So you don't have any concerns with telemetry and privacy issues.  And using your bandwidth with their p2p update system? Auto sharing wifi networks? Updates causing crash loops on lots of machines?  Your in ability to pick and choose updates, etc. .etc..

Your concerns are the icons are not pretty enough for you?  Really??

I can tell you one thing I am glad I didn't jump.. And will most likely be even pushing off the move until I get a full understanding of all the stuff they are doing - even though I am really interested in some of the networking changes like smb 3.1.1

 

[adrynalyne]

"Anyway, my only gripe at the moment is the use of legacy icons."

That is your gripe?  So you don't have any concerns with telemetry and privacy issues.  And using your bandwidth with their p2p update system? Auto sharing wifi networks? Updates causing crash loops on lots of machines?  Your in ability to pick and choose updates, etc. .etc..

Your concerns are the icons are not pretty enough for you?  Really??

I can tell you one thing I am glad I didn't jump.. And will most likely be even pushing off the move until I get a full understanding of all the stuff they are doing - even though I am really interested in some of the networking changes like smb 3.1.1

 

Why do you need those to be gripes when:

1. Telemetry not only can be turned off, but also exists in other versions of Windows.

2. WUDO can be turned off. Why gripe if it can be disabled?

3. Networks aren't shared unless you consciously share it out, and enter your key beforehand. The only thing enabled by default is the ability to do it. If it really bugs you, the ability can also be disabled.

4. Forced updates are a bit annoying. Settings is an app though and can be easily updated without huge fanfare.

Edited August 11, 2015 by adrynalyne
grammar

[techbeck]

To early to tell.  Give it 6 months to  year and then shall see how it is.  I like the new start menu but have had a few issues with upgrading, driver support, and apps working properly.  And not really sure yet on the forced updates. 

[+BudMan MVC]

Why gripe? Because this info is not given to the user up front that they will be doing it is my gripe.

In what other versions of windows are you talking about for the telemetry they are doing in 10?

My gripe is with the whole notion that if I give you access to my network you can just click and its shared with everyone you know.  There is one thing if you have to purposing give it to say billy or susan, but click and its shared with everyone you know - F! that.. WTF was MS thinking?

What I find funny is when it comes to a griping thread is peoples concerns our the icons are not pretty   Who gives a ###### what MS is tracking - they are giving us the OS for free. I just don't get this mentality to be honest.. Then on the other hand they bitch and complain about cookies tracking that they went to site X and now site Y can see it, etc.

 

 

[adrynalyne]

Why gripe? Because this info is not given to the user up front that they will be doing it is my gripe.

In what other versions of windows are you talking about for the telemetry they are doing in 10?

My gripe is with the whole notion that if I give you access to my network you can just click and its shared with everyone you know.  There is one thing if you have to purposing give it to say billy or susan, but click and its shared with everyone you know - F! that.. WTF was MS thinking?

What I find funny is when it comes to a griping thread is peoples concerns our the icons are not pretty   Who gives a ###### what MS is tracking - they are giving us the OS for free. I just don't get this mentality to be honest.. Then on the other hand they bitch and complain about cookies tracking that they went to site X and now site Y can see it, etc.

 

 

So who exactly are we polling people here? The average consumer, or the average poster on Neowin. I understand your concerns, but most of Windows privacy concerns can be avoided by simply not choosing Express Settings when upgrading or installing. It seems to me that those who are truly concerned about all these things are not the average consumer, and therefore know how to avoid enabling them, or turn them off.  Not that big of a deal. 

As for telemetry:

Windows 7

http://www.infoworld.com/article/2911609/operating-systems/kb-2952664-compatibility-update-for-win7-triggers-unexpected-daily-telemetry-run-may-be-snooping.html

Office:

https://technet.microsoft.com/en-us/library/hh220610(v=office.14).aspx

Windows RT

http://hal2020.com/2012/11/20/is-windows-rt-the-ultimate-example-of-using-telemetry/

Windows 8

http://www.geekwire.com/2012/microsoft-stats-reveal-users-windows-8/

How about Customer Experience Improvement Program?  You have to opt out in most MS apps when installing.

The biggest change in telemetry in Windows 10 is the additional voice data for Cortana. That and MS is more transparent in Windows 10, which has everyone in a panic.  If telemetry scares someone, they can turn it off. Worried about usage data with Cortana?  Don't use Cortana.  Easy peasy. Going to prior versions of Windows doesn't remove, nor disable telemetry.

 

Edited August 11, 2015 by adrynalyne

[jaffar]

Why gripe? Because this info is not given to the user up front that they will be doing it is my gripe.

In what other versions of windows are you talking about for the telemetry they are doing in 10?

My gripe is with the whole notion that if I give you access to my network you can just click and its shared with everyone you know.  There is one thing if you have to purposing give it to say billy or susan, but click and its shared with everyone you know - F! that.. WTF was MS thinking?

What I find funny is when it comes to a griping thread is peoples concerns our the icons are not pretty   Who gives a ###### what MS is tracking - they are giving us the OS for free. I just don't get this mentality to be honest.. Then on the other hand they bitch and complain about cookies tracking that they went to site X and now site Y can see it, etc.

 

 

Why are you still using Windows 7 if you don't trust Microsoft? How do you know there is no hidden backdoor in Windows 7 or even in Windows 98? it's the same (devilish) company

Linux/Mac/Windows 7 fanbois are making up flimsy justifications to stay with their lovely OSs.

[binaryzero]

Stupid home users, Microsoft has never been in trouble.

[birdie]

You must be joking right?

It has most of the problems of Windows 8.1, plus some of them are exaggerated.

It has a pseudo start menu which most sane people hate vehemently and require Classic Shell to be installed immediately.

Windows tiles/apps are exactly useful for 5% of users, because others still prefer either normal web pages or normal applications.

[Sekyal]

birdie you are clearly one from the past. Windows has to move forward to stay with the times or be left behind (where you are). I find this Start Menu far more useful than I ever did XP or Vista. It is faster to get to everything either with a couple of clicks or a quick search. I agree that apps/tiles are not widely used but that usage will increase with Windows 10 because now they feel more native and they are easier to install/uninstall than traditional programs. I find myself using them far more.

I've learned to adapt to each update of Windows rather than try to stay stuck in the past as some try to do.

[+Zagadka Subscriber²]

I don't know about "redemption", but MS is following a clear new path, which is promising. I will judge them by what they do, not what they did.

[cork1958]

I agree that MS didn't need any redeeming, but, IMO, Windows 10 does not do them any good either.

 

Even a bigger POS than Vista was out of the box, which is also IMO.

[Osiris]

I think the disappointing thing W10 has shown is how users and fans of MS have bent over and spread themselves so willingly.  The whole coming soon approach, the inconsistencies, missing features and bugs (although I concede every piece of software has these) it's just not good enough for a full commercial release.  We wouldn't have accepted this and they wouldn't have tried to pass this off in ages gone by but now we just settle for getting the equivalent of pre-release software because "it will get updated" or "its coming soon" or "you got it for free stfu".

[eiffel_g]

1. Regarding WU - I have Pro version - cannot use the Update selection - it's locked on Automatic. Seems only Enterprise has the option, wich is bad - not all comanies use enterprise, but a lot use PRO OEM - they buy preinsatlled on new hardware.

2. Regarding the new settings, my opinion is a bit confused. It ws time for such a change - linux has similar settings for a decade about, but the implementation is somewhat defective. The icons are so simplified that I cannot understand them if no description below ( lucky they put it ). Also navigation is difficult - lot of scroll as this is optimized for small touch screens. And somehow difficult to learn it.

3. It's quite odd, but after Vista Microsoft has tried to simplify the OS, each version has something removed. Also resources starting with 8 have been simplified, in 10 it's quite extreme that - bicolor icons very simple draws. But the strange thing - each version requires more space  - first on the DVD, second on HDD. how it's simplified in that case, I don't know.

4. About the Start Menu I'm also a bit confused - not very suitable for Desktop use - not easy to reconfigure tiles, or proper resize - I would like one vertical column for the Tiles - but it remains a big empty space at their right. Some accesories or old programs are hidden somewhere very deep inside. Also not very suitable for tablet use.

I would always prefered 2 independent shells - one for Desktop, one for Touch & Tablets. Usually mixes are bad for all as they cannot be perfectly optimized.

[birdie]

birdie you are clearly one from the past. Windows has to move forward to stay with the times or be left behind (where you are). I find this Start Menu far more useful than I ever did XP or Vista. It is faster to get to everything either with a couple of clicks or a quick search. I agree that apps/tiles are not widely used but that usage will increase with Windows 10 because now they feel more native and they are easier to install/uninstall than traditional programs. I find myself using them far more.

I've learned to adapt to each update of Windows rather than try to stay stuck in the past as some try to do.

You're clearly from the awful future where one has to adapt to all the #### which self-proclaimed UX specialists and designers throw at us. Yeah, you're right.

Consider the original Windows 95 UI where you could instantly find and understand everything, because we had clear paradigms in regard to the application: the menu, the application title, various control buttons, etc. etc. You could look at it and understand it right off the bat.

Compare it to modern ###### OSes like Windows 10, Android and iOS, where control elements have the same color and style and descriptions and other text where you have to spend hours trying to figure what is clickable and what is not. The same applies to modern websites. Windows 10 has over seven design paradigms, i.e. seven ways of configuring and working with different applications and apps. Isn't it grate? Oh boy.

Yeah, let's praise all the brokenness of the modern web/application design. Let's abandon our habits, let's decrease productivity, let's break our perception for the sake of the new. Wow.

People have collectively gone mad.

Tell me how Windows 10 start menu is ANY better than Windows 7 start menu. Tell me how TWO control panels (where one of them has completely broken text antialiasing) are better than one. Tell me how plain idiotic 8bit colors are better than the rich palette of Windows 7 which had amazing icons, beautiful translucency and configurability.

[Osiris]

The biggest change in telemetry in Windows 10 is the additional voice data for Cortana. That and MS is more transparent in Windows 10, which has everyone in a panic.  If telemetry scares someone, they can turn it off. Worried about usage data with Cortana?  Don't use Cortana.  Easy peasy. Going to prior versions of Windows doesn't remove, nor disable telemetry.

Except unlike previous versions of the OS...you know the ones where you had control over simple things like your updates and driver installs...when you turned off the telemetry options they stayed off.  To fully disable telemetry in the home and pro editions you need to disable services and make registry changes, only Enterprise will fully turn off telemetry via the GPE.  I don't call that transparency or business as usual anymore than I do the revised terms of service.

[Richard Burtov]

To those of you whinging about how Windows 10 has turned out - You are more than welcome to stay with your favourite OS, be it 7, XP or whatever. Let the rest of us move forward without having to hear you.

Privacy issues and telemetry - Most if not all software companies do it. Hardware companies too. Are you going to carry on using your Apple, Microsoft or Android phone / tablet when you realise that they also send telemetry data to the manufacturer AND your phone service provider?