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Has Windows 10 redeemed Microsoft?

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7Dash8    560

What else would Windows Phone run? Kludgy, x86 desktop apps? Gotta love those file menus, ammirite?

 

I know you're trying extra hard to miss the point, so I'll repeat it just one more time: the poor adoption of Windows phone is direct evidence of people's dislike of the metro UI and metro apps.

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adrynalyne    12,743

 

I know you're trying extra hard to miss the point, so I'll repeat it just one more time: the poor adoption of Windows phone is direct evidence of people's dislike of the metro UI and metro apps.

No it isn't.

Windows Phone is barely marketed, has a serious app gapp and carriers refuse to push it.

Most people have never seen it up close, much less used it.

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7Dash8    560

Right, that must be it. Windows 8 didn't fail because of metro, and Windows phone isn't unpopular because of metro. It's just a coincidence that both products have major metro integration and have flopped.

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Quillz    1,011

 

It has a pseudo start menu which most sane people hate vehemently and require Classic Shell to be installed immediately.

And I assume you have conducted some nice user studies to confirm such a claim?

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Quillz    1,011

 

Tell me how Windows 10 start menu is ANY better than Windows 7 start menu. Tell me how TWO control panels (where one of them has completely broken text antialiasing) are better than one. Tell me how plain idiotic 8bit colors are better than the rich palette of Windows 7 which had amazing icons, beautiful translucency and configurability.

Well, for me, I like having the live tiles in the Start menu. I have it set up so it shows me new e-mail, local weather, local sports and news updates. In addition, I can still type what I'm looking for. So, therefore, the Windows 10 Start menu is better than the Windows 7 Start menu. Again, for me, I don't speak for everyone (nor do you).

Windows 10 has the same number of colors as Windows 7. The UI may be using them differently but in no way are you limited to the "idiotic 8-bit colors." As for beautiful icons and translucency, that's purely subjective and a matter of opinion and shouldn't objectively used to compare the two OS. I, for one, did not like several elements of the Win7 UI. I generally prefer the Win10 UI based on several factors. But neither have been very good in terms of consistency, I still think Win2000 is the best Windows has ever looked purely from a consistent look and feel.

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Quillz    1,011

What else would Windows Phone run? Kludgy, x86 desktop apps? Gotta love those file menus, ammirite?

Perhaps it should. I have no interest in tablets specifically because they run a crippled OS that can't run most of the day-to-day software that I like to use. The reason I'm actually considering getting a Surface 3 Pro is because it runs the full Win10 OS. Granted, I can accept something like Windows Mobile on a smartphone, but the lack of those "kludgy, x86 desktop apps" is one of the big reasons WinRT hasn't taken off.

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BinaryData    777

In my opinion, no. Windows 10 is amazing, but Microsoft put too many Privacy Violations in there. I'm beginning to think that Ubuntu + Wine is better than Windows itself. Windows 10 feels NSA Friendly to me :p

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Quillz    1,011

In my opinion, no. Windows 10 is amazing, but Microsoft put too many Privacy Violations in there. I'm beginning to think that Ubuntu + Wine is better than Windows itself. Windows 10 feels NSA Friendly to me :p

Ubuntu actually got into some hot water a while back with its Launchpad software calling home and to various Internet servers, much like Win10. I think this increased lack of privacy is, unfortunately, something that all OS are going to fall victim to.

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BinaryData    777

Ubuntu actually got into some hot water a while back with its Launchpad software calling home and to various Internet servers, much like Win10. I think this increased lack of privacy is, unfortunately, something that all OS are going to fall victim to.

Oh really? I didn't know that. Thanks for that tidbit, what release version was it, do you remember?

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+suprNOVA    177

Ba dah pa pa paaa I'm lovin it :rofl:

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Quillz    1,011

Oh really? I didn't know that. Thanks for that tidbit, what release version was it, do you remember?

Well, it's been in every Ubuntu release since they introduced Launchpad. A couple years back, at least. Although in the most recent versions, they changed things up so you can at least turn off Internet search results, etc. Which is what you can do in Win10, but apparently it still calls home.

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adrynalyne    12,743

Right, that must be it. Windows 8 didn't fail because of metro, and Windows phone isn't unpopular because of metro. It's just a coincidence that both products have major metro integration and have flopped.

Show some evidence of otherwise then instead of making assumptions pulled from your posterior.

 

Should I use your logic to explain why GNU/Linux hasn't taken off on the desktop?

 

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offroadaaron    230

Should I use your logic to explain why GNU/Linux hasn't taken off on the desktop?

 

Go on?..

Windows has a user base already where as linux doesn't... But most people like Linux on phones and tablets, so I would say it's actually doing pretty well, definitely beating Windows Phone.

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adrynalyne    12,743

Go on?..

Windows has a user base already where as linux doesn't... But most people like Linux on phones and tablets, so I would say it's actually doing pretty well, definitely beating Windows Phone.

 

I think you misinterpreted what I was saying. I am in no way bashing GNU/Linux, but clearly one could say the user interface scares people off from it, just like the silly assumption about Windows Phone. Am I claiming that? Of course not.

Also, Android has a Linux kernel. It is NOT GNU/Linux, and is a mostly Java OS, which GNU/Linux clearly is not. A kernel may run the OS, but it does not define the OS.

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7Dash8    560

Show some evidence of otherwise then instead of making assumptions pulled from your posterior.

Should I use your logic to explain why GNU/Linux hasn't taken off on the desktop?

Firstly, why don't YOU take your own advice and show some evidence that Windows phone is failing because of "lack of marketing" :)

Secondly, how about I use your logic instead and claim that Linux hasn't taken off on the desktop because of lack of marketing. I mean, when was the last time you saw a Linux ad, right? So that must be it.

Instead of making up fantasy scenarios, pulled from your own posterior as you put it, maybe it's time for you to accept the possibility that Windows desktop users don't like a mobile-centric UI (metro) and mobile-centric apps on their desktop, based on the logical principle of Occam's Razor.

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adrynalyne    12,743

Firstly, why don't YOU take your own advice and show some evidence that Windows phone is failing because of "lack of marketing" :)

Secondly, how about I use your logic instead and claim that Linux hasn't taken off on the desktop because of lack of marketing. I mean, when was the last time you saw a Linux ad, right? So that must be it.

Instead of making up fantasy scenarios, pulled from your own posterior as you put it, maybe it's time for you to accept the possibility that Windows desktop users don't like a mobile-centric UI (metro) and mobile-centric apps on their desktop, based on the logical principle of Occam's Razor.

It doesn't work that way. The one who makes the claim has the responsibility of backing it up.

Or not, and then we don't take you seriously, like now.

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wrack    456

Apart from them taking control of my privacy, I am good with the rest of the changes. The UI feels a lack of polish but I am hoping that SP1 (Or a big fat next update) should take care of most of that.

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zhangm    1,345

PSA: we are not going down the name-calling route.

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Ravensky    632

Take any of the three new windows 10 apps, like the calculator, the timer and lets say mail, resize their windows, place them on a 2nd monitor, etc.  Now close them all, and I bet you at least two of them don't remember their size and monitor placement.  So utterly unacceptable Microsoft...just careless.

 

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zhangm    1,345

Take any of the three new windows 10 apps, like the calculator, the timer and lets say mail, resize their windows, place them on a 2nd monitor, etc.  Now close them all, and I bet you at least two of them don't remember their size and monitor placement.  So utterly unacceptable Microsoft...just careless.

Mail and Calendar are ok. Calc and the Timer app do not remember size or position, though they do remember their "mode".

Not happy that I can't tell Cortana "Set a timer for 57 seconds". Am pleased that the input field is able to do simple math operations.

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Ravensky    632

Mail and Calendar are ok. Calc and the Timer app do not remember size or position, though they do remember their "mode".

Not happy that I can't tell Cortana "Set a timer for 57 seconds". Am pleased that the input field is able to do simple math operations.

Yeah there are still a LOT of small touches for them to fix up, which I hope they do...  It should not have been released until all this minor stuff was fixed imo.

 

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7Dash8    560

Yep, the article covers my oft-repeated, but stubbornly and deliberately ignored common-sense points. Like Brad Wardell of Stardock regarding gimped apps:

"In the end, you get a mobile app running on your desktop without all of the features you probably wanted in the first place...I want to build real stuff, and I can’t build real stuff on that API"

The mobile/desktop divide is important to understand, Wardell says. “Apple understands that Mac OS is a different beast than iOS"
 

 The article nails it with this:

Universal Apps are simply a last ditch Hail Mary effort to make Microsoft relevant in mobile.. over the long run, it means that developers will gradually find less and less reason to build for Microsoft’s platforms at all. As iOS and Android apps get better and better, and iOS and Android tablets become closer and closer to replacing PCs, Windows will continue to lose relevance.

Basically, Microsoft is diluting its desktop OS, the one thing it does better than any other vendor, to undertake a clumsy, and extremely late "me too" chase for the mobile dollar - and failing at that. If you do something well, don't turn around and completely bastardize it just to try to do something else not so well.

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+Fahim S.    1,093

Go on?..

Windows has a user base already where as linux doesn't... But most people like Linux on phones and tablets, so I would say it's actually doing pretty well, definitely beating Windows Phone.

 

Surely the same can be claimed of Windows Phone and Windows RT as a smartphone/tablet OS - both Android and iOS had established user bases, making it very difficult (if not impossible) for Windows Phone and RT to break into the phone and tablet, having been late to the party (as desktop Linux was).

I have never met a single person who doesn't use Windows Phone because they disliked the UX (in fact quite the opposite) or the first party apps.  Their complaint has always been the availability of 3rd Party Apps and their quality. 

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