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14 minutes ago, Mindovermaster said:

I'm sorry, @DevTech, but you are talking about a big industry, not a little office run by 5 people.

 

@BudMan, can you help out here?

So NVMe is what we should get for consumer computers but business computers magically do better with slow hard drives? That's just completely self-contradictory hypocrisy!

 

Bet you everyone's gaming computer doesn't have a "good enough" hard drive!

 

Same tech. Same electrons going down the wire.

 

You can't spew out complete BS just because you say it's a "Business" thing... There is no reason that 5 people deserve to be ripped off, just because they are a "small" business. To them maybe it isn't small!

 

I never said it is a vital component, just that it is a better investment right now for a computer you buy in 2019 and expect to run for 11 years like his last one... 

 

He said he likes longevity. I took that into account... It's a subjective point I am making and I respect the other options being presented, but I noticed that the Dell website is VERY WEIRD around this after going through about 15 Dell Sever configs last night for this thread. Anyone else here do that?

 

It is silly that people are putting obsolete stuff on a pedestal with a gold trophy just so they can say their hard drives spin faster or something equally stupid as a badge of entry in the social club of Luddite thinking...

 

It's an investment purchase value hardware configuration opinion that I am politely expressing, and the resentment I am getting  is crazy silly "Not Invented Here Syndrome" and frankly not fair as I point out a sad evidence of bully-like behavior on the part of Dell and big suppliers.

 

EDIT: Also, I went to the effort to price out computers with SSD and NVMe that are in the same ballpark as the retro spinning thing configs. So what's your problem exactly? Same price, better hardware. Is there a law that says a 5 person company deserves to get ripped off and pay the same for stuff that is obsolete as soon as you drive it out of the lot?

 

 

NVME is not used to store data. NVME is ONLY beneficial when you are constantly read/write to it. Like why we use it for our OS drive.

 

Yesterday's servers are just as good as today's. Are they faster? No, but they get the job done in adequite time.

OP sent you a PM, but this is what I would use in that situation with the budget at hand - https://www.dropbox.com/s/cxwrn0pz9ysxwbc/Dell - Cart.pdf?dl=0

 

I would just add on a 5th drive as a hot-spare at time of order.

 

This is a 5 year system. planning needs to be made half-way through the 4th year for replacement/migration due to hardware warranty expire and budgeting. You can typically extend the warranty on these an additional two years for around $1200, but I would believe by that time the company may have outgrown these specs.

 

$7,000 every 5 years for a profitable business to keep doing their thing is well worth it.

I've done the research.

 

I've presented solid state configs that are in the same price range as spinning ones.

 

I don't think you need the complexity of RAID for NVMe but I presented a RAID-10 config on a SATA SSD scenario, again NOT MORE EXPENSIVE

 

The 15K drives will die for sure. They need the complexity of RAID for sure. Yet everyone adores them and my attempts to be rational and logical in looking at a system for the next 10 years has been like I was tearing the arms and legs off of everyone's favorite Teddy Bear.

 

So, I think I amassed a lot of useful information and there is probably no point in vexing people with more. So, I'll be happy to respond to specific questions, but please think of your Teddy Bear as being warm and safe and comfy and so on...

 

5 minutes ago, Mindovermaster said:

NVME is not used to store data. NVME is ONLY beneficial when you are constantly read/write to it. Like why we use it for our OS drive.

 

Yesterday's servers are just as good as today's. Are they faster? No, but they get the job done in adequite time.

Yeah that is so wrong, I will leave the fundamentals to another day. But you might want to look up "Database" and wonder if you read and write to it or not...

 

Again, I proposed modern stuff that was NOT more expensive. So when you buy your next computer one of your objectives by your statement here will be to buy obsolete stuff for the same money because you don't need YOUR money as much as Dell needs to make extra profit and since you value them as a Charity Organization, you will be happy to accept "just adequate" for the same money.

 

Sorry, I can't seriously advocate that to another human being, and I haven't.

 

4 minutes ago, Mindovermaster said:

I'm done. If anybody wants to fight with him, be my guest....

Seriously, it is horrible to view an intellectual debate as a "fight"

 

The objective here is not to "win" but hopefully to arrive at insights and fundamental truths that might have been hidden until we hammer it out all in good nature...

 

The "winner" is that everyone learns stuff. Everyone knows more about stuff.

 

I have certainly learned a lot of stuff, including the obviously emotional attachment people have to those Hot Swap 15K SAS Bays! I don't work with those every day and maybe if I did, I would be very munch fonder of them...

 

And I've learned a few technical things as well!

 

Maybe if everyone listed the stuff they learned in this thread (in good faith, no sarcasm) then we can see the GOOD being achieved.

 

2 minutes ago, DevTech said:

Seriously, it is horrible to view an intellectual debate as a "fight"

  

The objective here is not to "win" but hopefully to arrive at insights and fundamental truths that might have been hidden until we hammer it out all in good nature...

 

The "winner" is that everyone learns stuff. Everyone knows more about stuff.

 

I have certainly learned a lot of stuff, including the obviously emotional attachment people have to those Hot Swap 15K SAS Bays! I don't work with those every day and maybe if I did, I would be very munch fonder of them...

 

And I've learned a few technical things as well!

 

Maybe if everyone listed the stuff they learned in this thread (in good faith, no sarcasm) then we can see the GOOD being achieved.

 

Fight may be the wrong word, umm... reason with you?

@DevTech database performance really depends.  To say that you will absolutely see a performance increase is a bit bold.  To say you should theoretically see a performance increase is more accurate. As stated before I went from a 15000 rpm sas array to a flash array and saw no performance increase what so ever.  I cannot say that it was worth it to switch other than for the fact that the array was end of life. 

2 minutes ago, DevTech said:

ALWAYS, am I open to friendly exchanges of information, say I.

 

@DevTechI've been following this thread for awhile as well as some of your other posts... Sometimes you come off a tad bit on the hostile side...

7 minutes ago, sc302 said:

@DevTech database performance really depends.  To say that you will absolutely see a performance increase is a bit bold.  To say you should theoretically see a performance increase is more accurate. As stated before I went from a 15000 rpm sas array to a flash array and saw no performance increase what so ever.  I cannot say that it was worth it to switch other than for the fact that the array was end of life. 

Right on! Sure that can happen. And it sure doesn't hurt to repeat we can't sit down with @patseguinand perform a complete Needs Assessment and measurement of his current DB setup.

 

So we do our best with general principles and hope there isn't a lot of "edge case" stuff like yours.

 

And there are so many different types of database tech for which different rules apply. Not simple.

 

I think if the cost is in the same ball park, he benefits by starting with a more modern config since he for sure does hold onto his stuff a long time. Logically he should see an employee or systemic productivity boost from the faster SSD but that can't be proven.

 

I think he is navigating the barrage of sometimes contradictory info very well and May The Force Be With Him...

 

3 minutes ago, DevTech said:

And it sure doesn't hurt to repeat we can't sit down with @patseguinand perform a complete Needs Assessment and measurement of his current DB setup.

 

With 5 users and what appears to be an embroidery shop? I'm just going to venture a guess but 1: A "Needs Assessment" isn't necessary and 2: Nothing they are doing is going to cause I/O queuing on this database that they are running.

 

Sometimes simple with a good warranty is sufficient.

14 minutes ago, Matthew S. said:

@DevTechI've been following this thread for awhile as well as some of your other posts... Sometimes you come off a tad bit on the hostile side...

I'm not a social person. I don't do glue words well. And smiley faces where they should be :) And I zero in on the data and often go nuts on the info.

 

On the other hand people insult me like crazy and I just ignore it and try to figure out what their data points are.

 

I would not want to see harm come to a single human being on this planet, not even orange haired clowns... But my humor formed in an overdose of Monty Python and that can sure seem hostile at times if you don't have trust in the underlying purpose...

 

 

3 minutes ago, xendrome said:

With 5 users and what appears to be an embroidery shop? I'm just going to venture a guess but 1: A "Needs Assessment" isn't necessary and 2: Nothing they are doing is going to cause I/O queuing on this database that they are running.

 

Sometimes simple with a good warranty is sufficient.

Yeah have you been reading the same thread?

 

That is exactly what we are discussing.

 

I think a simple SSD is VASTLY more simple than a RAID-5 15K Hot Swap SAS Bay full of drives about to die!

 

So, a simple SSD based system with a good warranty is sufficient.

 

Right? 

 

6 minutes ago, DevTech said:

I'm not a social person. I don't do glue words well. And smiley faces where they should be :) And I zero in on the data and often go nuts on the info.

 

On the other hand people insult me like crazy and I just ignore it and try to figure out what their data points are.

 

I would not want to see harm come to a single human being on this planet, not even orange haired clowns... But my humor formed in an overdose of Monty Python and that can sure seem hostile at times if you don't have trust in the underlying purpose...

 

 

Quite a few of us are introverts here.   I consider myself to be one.   My wife hates that I am so quiet and that text resonates with me more than verbal conversation and the fact I don’t talk at home.  I am fun to be around, the life of the party.....if everyone was dead.

 

I don’t know everything, I want to learn and I want to engage. 

Just now, sc302 said:

Quite a few of us are introverts here.   I consider myself to be one.   My wife hates that I am so quiet and that text resonates with me more than verbal conversation and the fact I don’t talk at home.  I am fun to be around, the life of the party.....if everyone was dead. 

Try the morgue.... 🤣

1 minute ago, Mindovermaster said:

Try the morgue.... 🤣

Thats humor and well intentioned, but he has a serious point.

 

When you live in a city of millions of people and you realize that maybe if you had a telepathic sensor you could find 10 other people if you were lucky that could sit in the same room with you and we glance at each other and everyone get's it... no words exchanged...

 

16 minutes ago, sc302 said:

Quite a few of us are introverts here.   I consider myself to be one.   My wife hates that I am so quiet and that text resonates with me more than verbal conversation and the fact I don’t talk at home.  I am fun to be around, the life of the party.....if everyone was dead.

 

I don’t know everything, I want to learn and I want to engage. 

I am DEEPLY moved by your post.

 

I have noticed already that you vigorously argue your opinions but honestly and immediately learn and adapt and correct mistakes so you already had my deepest respect for that.

 

But now, I would like to add that if anything I have said seemed unfair or nasty, I am very very sorry. Please don't hesitate to point out at any time if I am disturbing you or anyone. I will be happy to learn there...or anywhere... or with green eggs and ham..there I go again...

 

 

1 hour ago, DevTech said:

Yeah have you been reading the same thread?

 

That is exactly what we are discussing.

 

I think a simple SSD is VASTLY more simple than a RAID-5 15K Hot Swap SAS Bay full of drives about to die!

 

So, a simple SSD based system with a good warranty is sufficient.

 

Right? 

 

I totally disagree, this is a profit making business here. Downtime means loss of revenue and that means people can lose their jobs. I've run and migrated to/from dozens of servers with platter drives and have only had 2 failures in 15 years on Dell OEM hardware. Thank god for RAID5/10 setups, having a hot-spare available meant no downtime since I did not have to restore a backup image, had a hard drive from Dell in under 2 hours to replace the hotspare. These dell drives are enterprise level also, not consumer level.

 

Plus earlier you were talking about read/write ops on the drive and database I/O performance, if this was infact a database that would benefit from SSD for performance because of the load it was under I would be leery about using a single SSD for constant read/writes due to the wearing on the drives over a 5 year+ span, he said they had their current server for double that.

20 minutes ago, xendrome said:

 

I totally disagree, this is a profit making business here. Downtime means loss of revenue and that means people can lose their jobs. I've run and migrated to/from dozens of servers with platter drives and have only had 2 failures in 15 years on Dell OEM hardware. Thank god for RAID5/10 setups, having a hot-spare available meant no downtime since I did not have to restore a backup image, had a hard drive from Dell in under 2 hours to replace the hotspare. These dell drives are enterprise level also, not consumer level.

 

Plus earlier you were talking about read/write ops on the drive and database I/O performance, if this was infact a database that would benefit from SSD for performance because of the load it was under I would be leery about using a single SSD for constant read/writes due to the wearing on the drives over a 5 year+ span, he said they had their current server for double that.

1. Your first point is moot since I configured a RAID-10 system using Dell Enterprise SSD at no more cost than the Teddy Bears.

 

2. I did in fact make a NVMe config with a single Non-RAID 1.6 TB Dell Hot Swap Enterprise NVMe SSD but that could easily be changed to a RAID-1 1 TB Dell NVMe Hot Swap SSD in a 2.5 inch carrier into the already configed 12 Bay NVMe Chassis which also has a 12 Bay normal 2.5" set. The cost might be +$200 for that. I wish I had not posted that config without RAID because everyone just jumped on this and ignored all the other good info.

 

3. I don't understand that now that Dell has developed and sells Enterprise Hot Swap NVMe drives in pluggable 2.5" carriers that it GETS NO RESPECT (Rodney Dangerfield) which I attribute to pure nostalgia for the Jet Engine whine of 15K drives. (that warm fuzzy Teddy Bear)

 

4. I have already pointed out that Dell Engineering is first class but the sales side appears complicit here in an attempt to get rid of all their Teddy Bears first before pushing the better solution.

 

 

Dell Enterprise/Small Business NVMe

 

In the hope that a picture is worth a thousand words:

 

Dell PowerEdge Express Flash NVMe PCIe SSD 2.5 inch Small Form Factor User’s Guide

https://www.dell.com/support/manuals/us/en/04/dell-poweredge-exp-fsh-nvme-pcie-ssd/nvmepciessdug/hot-swap?guid=guid-cad180ee-8e6e-41f5-8442-a81a222faa2f&lang=en-us

 

Technical specifications

https://www.dell.com/support/manuals/us/en/04/dell-poweredge-exp-fsh-nvme-pcie-ssd/nvmepciessdug/technical-specifications?guid=guid-c3a629c4-936e-4dc8-bbef-10825da7b223&lang=en-us

 

Here it is:

 

dell-nvme-front.thumb.jpg.507098e62a8c3612b165a59fbe140fbe.jpg

 

 

 

Dell-nvme-plug.thumb.jpg.d7a35c312b4614c0bd32d24d3a4d2619.jpg

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

1 hour ago, DevTech said:

 

 

But now, I would like to add that if anything I have said seemed unfair or nasty, I am very very sorry. Please don't hesitate to point out at any time if I am disturbing you or anyone. I will be happy to learn there...or anywhere... or with green eggs and ham..there I go again...

 

I see it as part of having a conversation and part of having knowledge. You will defend what you know or you think you know until proven wrong.  I am ok with being wrong but need a bit more than “because I said so”.  My intentions are to have you think of a better answer because the one you gave isn’t intelligent enough.  I never look for textbook answers, if you have enough knowledge of a subject you can break down that subject well enough that a five year old can understand. If you have problems articulating yourself to that point you don’t know the subject matter enough and in my opinion should not continue. Many people on this site don’t know technology enough to be able to do that.  If I am challenging you is because I don’t understand the angle or what you are talking about.  

 

It took me a long time to understand this fact, not everyone needs the latest and greatest especially if it is out if their price range.  You have understand and be ok with that fact.  When I put a computer together for someone I want to get them the best board, memory, processor, etc..because that is what I would want...that isn’t what they want or need. You have to really listen and ask questions and find out what they really need and what they want. If it can’t come together with what they want see what they need and if you can give them a little more but don’t be afraid to give them just what they need and what he needs in this case is a system that will last, it doesn’t need to be a top performer or the fastest thing available. Prepare for failure in the system but don’t over spec. It is hard to know everything but it isn’t enterprise, it is mom and pop. Flash ssd/sas ssd is expensive.  Imo it isn’t worth the price of admission. Also spend the 40 or whatever bucks to get the chassis with the largest hot swap drives so the system can keep running if you ever have to swap a drive out (cute handle things). Storage and memory should be the main concern.  Any Xeon processor should handle whatever load he puts on it.   That is my last attempt to talk you off the edge of small business insanity. It is ok that dell and big boxes have these options.  It is ok for this type of business. It will be absolutely fine as it will be supported in the fullest extent. It is perfectly ok, it is not in your control what they do and do not offer and that too is ok.  Don’t worry about it not being the best or latest tech, it is ok that it is not.  Whatever it is will be much better than what he has. Whatever it is will have a long term or potential of long term warranty. It truly is ok. 

3 minutes ago, DevTech said:

I'll read in detail later - gotta run out

 

Part I don't get is I "found the handles" for NVMe and config at same price

 

So whats wrong?

 

Nothing is wrong,  just saying it is ok to go with a “lesser” option.  It is simply ok. Nothing is really wrong. 

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Before we dive in, you can view the different SKUs released so far since the 2025 series launched for Home and SMB users, with the most important specifications listed along with the MSRP listed below: SKU CPU Cores Memory Link Price F2-425 Intel N5095 4 4 GB DDR4 2.5 GbE x1 $249.99 F4-425 Intel N5095 4 4 GB DDR4 2.5 GbE x1 $369.99 F2-425 Plus Intel Core N150 4 8 GB DDR5 5 GbE x 2 $399.99 F4-425 Plus Intel Core N150 4 16 GB DDR5 5 GbE x 2 $569.99 F4-425 Pro Intel Core N305 8 8 GB DDR5 5 GbE x 2 $699.99 F4-425 Pro Intel Core N350 8 16 GB DDR5 5 GbE x 2 $799.99 The F2 in the product name means two 3.5-inch HDD bays, where F4 is four 2.5-inch bays. First impressions Like with the F8 SSD Plus packaging, the F4-425 Pro is using the upgraded box materials, which certainly look better than a plain cream colored box with TERRAMASTER stamped on the sides. The box gives off a premium feel and certainly adds a positive vibe to first impressions. In the box F4-425 Pro TNAS device Power adapter LAN cable (CAT 6) Quick guide [full online guide] Limited warranty notice Screws (for HDD bays) Stickers 2x rubber feet (spares) Design As has become kind of common with TerraMaster, certainly in the last three years, the 2025 F2- and F4-series have received a makeover that really adds to the premium feel of the NAS. Gone are the plastic shells, now replaced with an aluminum outer shell, with the front and back retaining the textured black plastic we saw on the 2024 models. Some key differences from the 2024 series include placing the power button back on the front, along with the addition of a Type A USB port. It's not much bigger or heavier either; in fact, it weighs 500 grams less than the F4-424 Pro. It's slightly shorter in height and depth (length), but only by a few millimeters. The front and back do retain a similar style to the 2024 series. On the front, you just have your four bays along with LED indicators for the HDDs and power. The welcomed change is having a USB port on the front for quick access, should you need to back up a USB drive, for example. Around the back, from top to bottom, you have a reset pin hole, an HDMI port, two 5 GbE Ethernet ports, two USB 3.2 Gen 2 (10 Gbps) Type A ports with a Type-C port below them, and a connector for the barrel port power source. Again, there's no Kensington Security Slot present, which is a bit of a shame considering it's a data storage device. Left side Right side On the left and right of the F4-425 Plus, it is completely smooth aluminum with a TERRAMASTER logo printed on both sides. On the bottom, there are some holes to assist ventilation. Unlike with the F4-425 Plus, the rubber feet did come unstuck during the teardown, which was also an issue on the 2023 series. It seems like other customers have lodged complaints about them, as TerraMaster now includes two spare rubber feet in the box, in case any of the preinstalled ones are lost; however, this seems more like a papering over the cracks solution rather than actually fixing the issue with better quality rubber stand-offs. There are also four screws that must be removed in order to access the internals. Teardown Upon removing the four screws, you can slide the device out of its shell to reveal the three NVMe M.2 slots (PCIe 3.0 X1) and single SODIMM slot connector, which is populated with a single 16GB DDR5 4800MT/s module. I added a couple of MP44Q M.2 PCIe 4.0 SSDs (2 x 4TB) that can be availed on Amazon for $492.99 that TEAMGROUP supplied us with, along with a 250GB 970 Evo Plus that my colleague Chris White sent me by accident and let me keep a few years ago. As I have said in previous reviews, TerraMaster support staff actually encourage installing whatever you want on their devices, and happily, the USB port for the bootloader is now easily accessible should you want to use it for your own flavor of NAS OS, such as TrueNAS, Unraid, or maybe Xpenology. Yes, because TerraMaster has now switched to a 256 GB NAND Flash card (3rd photo above) for the TOS bootloader. This is also replaceable, but you can also simply add a USB bootloader, access the BIOS, and tell the F4-425 Pro to boot from that instead of the Flash card. Unlike earlier iterations of TerraMaster NAS, you don't have to tear this down any further than the four screws on the outer shell in order to be able to access and manage the memory, NVMe slots, and USB bootloader. However, if you need to access the NAND Flash card or CMOS battery, then eight more screws (four on each side) need to be removed in order to take off the rear panel with the 120mm fan, and then the motherboard can be lifted off and removed from the SATA connector PCB. There's also no risk of threading the screw holes, because the four that hold the shell in place are metal on metal, while the screws that hold the rear panel on do screw into plastic. Either way, like last time when I reviewed the F4-425 plus, I was just happier to see larger screws being used. Overall, it follows some great improvements in build quality from the 2024 series and earlier. Setup BIOS The F4-425 Pro includes an Aptio BIOS from American Megatrends [1, 2], and you can setup pretty much everything here including the boot order, which is locked to the UEFI OS, however above that choice you can enable or disable booting to the USB bootloader so this would still allow you to switch to a USB stick with an alternative bootloader and boot from it, or disable it to instead always start from the first disk with an OS installed on it. Initial Setup Setup is roughly the same as the F4-425 Plus, along with the new TOS 7 setup dialogs, so there will be no surprises here. Upon connecting to the LAN and booting up, the F4-425 Pro can be reached by navigating to http://tnas.local. If that doesn't work, you can use the local address assigned via DHCP, which you can find using the TNAS PC desktop application, which is essentially a TerraMaster NAS finder. The setup process is pretty straightforward, through a wizard, and in full below: TOS 7 Initialization As you can see, TOS 7 received a new coat of paint, and the initialization requires fewer interactions. Happily, TOS no longer decides to throw all disks into the same Storage Pool; 2.5-inch HDDs are allocated into Storage Pool 1. This is because two of the HDDs are allocated to hold system files. Previously (with TOS 5 and 6), if you pre-installed HDDs and SSDs, they were all placed into Storage Pool 1, even if you did not select the SSDs for inclusion during the onboarding. TOS 7 Setup On first boot, there is a tutorial and some steps to take to harden the TNAS (or not), which includes an immediate update from TOS 7.0.0616 to 7.0.0706, of which the changelog screenshot is also included in the above gallery. It must be noted that the Security Advisor still contains (in my opinion) a pretty major bug in that if you enable SPC and then do the required rebooting, the Security Advisor still says that SPC is disabled. TerraMaster provided the following statement about it: It is disappointing that TOS 7 has been in beta since December, and this OOBE issue is still there. Shutdown option has moved Instead of a Taskbar option to manage the NAS, all of these options have been moved to a "Start panel", initially I didn't see it and my contact had to show me how to power off the F4-425 Pro. To logout, reboot or power off you can find those controls at the top right of the Panel. It is also possible to power off through the TNAS mobile app beta. Storage setup Above, you can see the steps I took to create the Storage Pools and Volumes. I made a second Storage Pool using TRAID on two 4TB MP44Q SSDs (which, in this instance, is similar to RAID 5), and finally, I added the 250GB 970 Evo Plus drive as Hyper Cache on Storage Pool 1 in Balanced mode. Registering If you decide not to lock down the F4-425 Pro in Security Isolation Mode (blocking all external connections), then you could set up a TNAS device ID through the Remote Access setting in the Control Panel (which must be unique). This works in combination with an online TerraMaster account. TOS 7 TNAS Online Creating a TerraMaster account and linking the device online activates the warranty when you provide proof of purchase and the serial number, but it also gives you access through the TNAS mobile app, which allows you to complete certain operationsб including powering off and restarting the NAS remotely. A TNAS mobile update is required to gain access through TOS 7, and this is provided on the TerraMaster website, as it is not yet on Google Play. The app is evolving all the time and has made leaps and bounds since I first started reviewing TerraMaster devices almost three years ago. It is not quite there yet if you are comparing the likes of Synology, which, sadly, a lot of users online do all the time. OpenClaw setup One of the main selling points of the new F4-425 Pro is the inclusion of OpenClaw, with TerraMaster claiming that it is "powered by the world's first AI-native TOS 7 OS, supporting local-first smart workflows and independent data control." However, I immediately ran into problems trying to enable OpenClaw. After waiting 20 minutes at the "Enabling" message of the OpenClaw app following installation, I decided to do some searching online and discovered that it couldn't complete the installation process due to SPC being enabled, which is something TOS 7 immediately recommends to be enabled on first boot. SPC for NAS (TOS 7) is basically the same principle as UAC in Windows; it blocks executables from being launched by non-Super Users. After reaching out to my contact about these issues, I received the following response: Anyway, this only became clear when I closed the OpenClaw app screen and clicked on the OpenClaw icon in the taskbar; that is when I saw the message about disabling SPC. I think, due to the fact that this is a requirement, this should be a prompt during the installation process, not when closing the App Market and then trying to launch OpenClaw. There's also no 'Getting started' guide for people like me who have never used OpenClaw. I tried to add an LLM and discovered the tutorial led nowhere. That's when I started looking around the official TerraMaster forums, and I found a guide that helpfully explains that you won't get anywhere with OpenClaw unless you have a paid plan, which is disappointing because I imagined there would be an option to use a local LLM as I do in SubtitleEdit with Whisper-XXL. In addition, with the marketing imagery on the official site, it says that the OpenClaw feature is "all processed 100% locally for absolute privacy." which led me to believe that I could install a local LLM, not one that required paid tokens. In any case, TerraMaster does not provide guidance for this new feature, which was also a selling point of the F4-425 Pro! My contact also provided clarification about the above points I raised with TerraMaster Since it is not in the scope of the review to add paid services, I'll leave that to the people who are more qualified with OpenClaw. F4-425 Pro Surveillance App TOS also comes with a Surveillance app, which is not installed by default; it can be found in the App Market recommended section. In addition, after installing, it doesn't drop a shortcut on the Desktop or top taskbar, but you can "Send to Desktop" from the App Market listing for the app for a quick way to open it. Adding my Reolink POE doorbell camera was painless. TerraMaster doesn't appear to have a repository of preconfigured cameras; instead, the camera must be added using ONVIF or RTSP. No mobile Surveillance app TerraMaster still doesn't have a dedicated Surveillance app, although from searching online, Surveillance can be used and managed through the TNAS mobile app. I tried this with the updated TNAS mobile app beta in combination with TOS 7 and got a message that Surveillance was "Only accessible through web browser," so I reckon this must be limited to the stable versions of TOS 6 and the mobile app. More quirks In addition, whenever I minimized the Live View window in the browser Surveillance app, the feed appeared to switch to the Low-bandwidth stream, and there was no way to get the High-quality stream back. To get the High-quality stream back, I had to close Live View and then reopen it. Benchmarking A pretty cool feature of the TOS 7 is that it allows you to install directly to the NVMe M.2 SSD. In order to do that, you would have to leave out any HDDs during initialization, and even then, the system partitions are always written to two HDDs when they are eventually added. With three NVMe slots, this also gives an interesting scenario where you could build a TRAID storage Pool for installing all your apps and Docker on, and keep the third for SSD cache on the HDD pool. Limitless options! SATA PCIe 3.0 X1 A CrystalDiskMark test on a mapped network drive from within a Windows 11 25H2 PC (image above) connected over a 5 GbE hub was well within acceptable ranges. Although the read result on SATA was a little less than with the F4-425 Plus, for some reason, while writes were generally better. SATA PCIe 3.0 X1 I also ran the NAS Performance tester, which tests the link speed performance. As you can see, it pretty much maxes out the 5GbE connection. Of course, you can also opt to bond the two 5 GbE connections for a bit more umph, but I didn't do that. TOS 7, which, as of testing, is still in Beta, comes with an App Center that has a bunch of handy programs you can install right off the bat, such as Emby, Plex, Docker, as well as in-house Backup and Surveillance solutions. As you can imagine, any media streaming services you would want to host off the F4-425 Pro will work great, thanks to the Intel Core N350 CPU and its 16 GB of DDR5 memory. Accessing from mobile is only possible if Security Isolation Mode is disabled, which can put your NAS at risk from external sources, so there was no way to access it from the TNAS Mobile app. It's also quiet. I had this sat next to my computer on my work desk for the past week, and I did wonder if the noise I was accustomed to with NAS devices would annoy me, but all I could hear was a soft whirring of the rear fan (which was a little annoying) when the disks were not actively copying or reading data. Conclusion So what have I learned? Unfortunately, this release raises a few important questions and concerns that I feel haven't been adequately addressed. What I didn't like Our variant shipped with TOS 7 beta, and it's advised not to use it in a production environment. I feel that's a bit limiting on an $800 device. The mobile app is also still in beta and does not support some of the first-party apps, like Surveillance, and it still has quite a few bugs. I am a bit confused about the OpenClaw marketing along with the F4-425 Pro. I feel like that if it's going to be a main selling point, then offer official guidance on how to get started with it. TerraMaster recommends enabling SPC, but then markets the NAS for use with OpenClaw, which requires disabling SPC to be able to use it, opening up genuine security concerns for the NAS; and that's before you get into the security concerns of OpenClaw itself. Of course, the above issues won't be a problem if you decide to install something else on it, or even go back to the stable TOS 6. I wish TerraMaster had just given TOS 7 as opt-in rather than shipping with it. TOS 7 has been available as a preview since December 2025 (so well before my last TerraMaster review), and according to a thread on Reddit where a user shared a screenshot from the TerraMaster Facebook page, it is scheduled to launch today, June 23, but there's nothing about that in the TerraMaster news blog. My contact confirmed over email that TOS 7 exits beta today. The rubber feet also deserve a mention as they continue to be a problem, with them coming unstuck the moment you shift the F4-425 Pro anywhere on your desk. What I liked What it comes down to, though, aside from what I already mentioned, you are still getting a quality, affordable device here, so recommending it will depend on the individual's use case. If you're just looking for a relatively small NAS device to manage virtual machines on, backup your files, and take care of your home theater streaming, then it is a great device that will certainly futureproof you for some time. It provides good performance, takes up little space, and is, on the whole, very quiet. Four bays afford proper redundancy using TRAID or RAID 5, and you can even expand on storage capacity by adding the 2-bay D5, or 4-bay D8 Hybrid DAS over a USB 3.2 (10Gbps) link. Considering the 2024 releases were more about power, with the likes of an Intel Core i5-1235U high-end laptop CPU under the hood, I asked my contact last time if we could expect more of the same in higher-end models and was told: It makes a lot of sense to use Intel's N350 chip inside a NAS; it is more than capable of doing what the F4-425 Pro is intended for, media streaming and backup. The only downside is still the clear lack of community and even staff support on the official forums. In the past, I have had topics go unanswered for days, or there would be generic-type "we've noted this and passed it onto our developer team" type responses. Along with the other things I mentioned, it all ends up costing it a couple of points. If you are comfortable with the command line, Docker, and setting up TrueNAS or Unraid, you'll be fine. You can do great things with this hardware. In TOS, the apps are a bit lacking, and things don't always work as expected.\ AI NAS?! What has become clear to me this year is that we are going to start seeing all kinds of "AI NAS" come to market, and while that might be good for us consumers, be diligent and research these claims. Although the F4-425 Pro technically comes with AI, it is really using a cloud service that is externally sourced off-device through the third party OpenClaw app. My colleague did review a newcomer to the NAS space earlier this year, and it includes a local AI assistant inside the Zettlab D4 NAS, and they do not even use AI in the product name, check out Chris' review here. Where to buy and a discount coupon However, it does not change the fact that this is truly a great entry-level home media-class NAS that you can buy right now. TerraMaster is having a 20% off launch discount, plus you can also still apply our unique 10% off coupon on checkout, which only works on the official website. So here is a breakdown of the pricing that is only valid on the official TerraMaster website. TerraMaster F4-425 Pro (N350) + 20% discount + 10% coupon = $575.99 TerraMaster F4-425 Pro (N305) + 20% discount + 10% coupon = $503.99 TerraMaster F4-425 Pro (N350) + 20% discount + 10% coupon = £525.59 TerraMaster F4-425 Pro (N305) + 20% discount + 10% coupon = £460.79 Use NEOWIN coupon code during checkout for 10% discount Over on Amazon US and UK, the F4-425 Pro also gets a 20% launch discount, but here, the above 10% coupon cannot be applied. TerraMaster F4-425 Pro (N350) for $639.99 at Amazon US (was $799.99) TerraMaster F4-425 Pro (N305) for $559.99 at Amazon US (was $699.99) TerraMaster F4-425 Pro (N350) for £583.99 at Amazon UK (was £729.99) TerraMaster F4-425 Pro (N305) for £511.99 at Amazon UK (was £639.99) As an Amazon Associate, when you purchase through links on our site, we earn from qualifying purchases.
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