World of Warcraft

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Grand Master

Spyder Veteran

Posted
  • Veteran
Posted
Ret Pallys have been literally raping DPS since the patch, and do need to get hit by the nerf stick IMHO. Hopefully Ret Pallys aren't nerfed to their spot pre-patch which did have laughable dps.
which is more or less what i said so needless to say i agree with you.

the big thing is all the new instant attacks with low cooldowns. instant attacks + 2 handers = rape. i hope what ends up happening is that they just adjust the numbers so theres not as much burst damage and spread it out over time more. i think that should help.

it can't go back to the way it was before..it just can't. it was really bad before. there has to be happy median and I hope they find it

Proficient

39 Thieves

Posted
Posted
Best case: in 3 months I'll be having as much fun as I was last week.

And for the rest of the millions of normal humans that don't treat this game like a job, probably much longer.

Sorry, but you "uber" raiding guilds partially create the problems yourselves.

Grand Master

dead.cell

Posted
Posted
which is more or less what i said so needless to say i agree with you.

the big thing is all the new instant attacks with low cooldowns. instant attacks + 2 handers = rape. i hope what ends up happening is that they just adjust the numbers so theres not as much burst damage and spread it out over time more. i think that should help.

That's what they plan to do:

Divine Storm -- the damage was changed from Holy to Physical. As you know, Holy damage is almost never mitigated and this talent could pack a lot into a very short time. This is a nerf to the ability's damage. This change is now active on Live.

Repentance -- this ability now lasts for only 6 seconds in PvP (down from 10). Obviously this is also a nerf. This change is also active on Live.

Art of War -- now affects all damage done by Judgements, Crusader Strike and Divine Storm (instead of critical strike damage). Net dps should be about the same but less bursty. This change will be made before Nov 13.

Righteous Vengeance -- now applies a dot affect similar to Deep Wounds (instead of critical strike damage). This ends up being a significant buff to the ability to make up for the damage lost to Divine Storm, but is also less bursty. This change will be made before Nov 13. EDIT: The dot will NOT break Repentance.

Glyph of Crusader Strike -- now reduces mana cost (instead of increased damage on stunned targets.) We thought paladins could stack too much damage vs. stunned targets. This change will be made before Nov 13.

We also fixed a bug with Seal and Judgement of Light that could sometimes result in too much healing.

In our tests, Retribution dps remains the same over longer periods of time, but they can't do quite so much damage in the initial few seconds of a PvP encounter.

I dunno, I'll be happy with these changes. Love the ret pally now. :p

They also said a bit about buffing Holy's damage as it seems to be low.

Grand Master

the evn show

Posted
Posted
And for the rest of the millions of normal humans that don't treat this game like a job, probably much longer.

Would you describe people who play a round of golf on Saturday and Sunday as "working a second job"? How about taking a trip to the ski hill every other weekend or too the race track every Wednesday and Friday night?

Why is it that when one person plays and has fun it's okay, when somebody else does and has more to show for it: it isn't?

Also, why wouldn't the millions of non-?ber players not start having fun in Naxx shortly after turning level 80 or becoming competitive in Arena? For me it'll be a rehash of content I did years ago but now with training wheels turned on, for them it could be new & interesting mechanics with a pile of story line to go with it.

Sorry, but you "uber" raiding guilds partially create the problems yourselves.

Blizzard took away Sunwell: the only way I could have avoided this would be to start playing poorly, join a much less/slower progressing guild and wait for this patch. As for their being nothing challenging at 80: that's Blizzards fault. The encounters are now under tuned the same way Kara/gruul/mag were over tuned for introductory raids. Likewise Heroic 5-man content under tuned.

If you found Naxx-80 10-man as easy to clear as Karazhan after 3.0 would you find it a rewarding experience? Many people in this thread have stated that killing new bosses at any level of ?kael, illidan, <anything in sunwell>?didn't really have a sense of accomplishment. That's what everyone will be running in to if the level 80 content ships under-tuned.

Proficient

Crompee

Posted
Posted
The relevant abilities are:
  • Blast Nova: 60 sec CD, about 2,500 damage every 2 seconds for 10 seconds to every player in the lair
    When the channel breaks, the player receives the 90 sec Mind Exhaustion debuff

If you can find alternate information for them, I'd love to see them but neither wowwiki nor wowhead have longer durations for mind exhaustion or shorter cooldowns for blast nova.

He was first killed by Nihlium on Feb 25: a video of that encounter shows Awake click the cubes twice in 2 minutes. That demonstrates that more than 2 cube groups has never been a requirement for a kill.

You had me doubting myself then as i couldnt find it anywhere on google lol.. but found it on a nihilum column in the end:

"At number 4: Magtheridon. This old ruler of Outland is supposed to be an entry level raid encounter in TBC, but he certainly wasn't tuned like that. Raids with fresh 70s that had just geared up through Karazhan and heroics were confronted with an insanely overtuned encounter, wiping any raid that even dared to enter the lair. It started with the trash, packs of 3 caster mobs doing AoE fears, 3k AoE shadow bolts and hitting like a truck; with today's standard they should have dropped T6 items. If you managed to kill these packs and reach Magtheridon, you were confronted with no less then 5 of these mobs guarding him. Attacking these guards would start the encounter and Magtheridon would join the fight in a few minutes. To make it a bit harder, these 5 guards also spawned elementals on a regular basis, as they had to be stronger then the normal trash, of course. If you managed to deal with the 5 adds before Magtheridon joined in, then the real encounter could start, the oh-so-feared cube clicking. That part of the encounter is basically the same as today, except that the debuff the player received after clicking a cube was 4 times longer than today, and each cube needed a 4 player rotation on it to stop Magtheridon from doing his AoE. As an extra bonus, Magtheridon would aggro all the trash in his liar, which was on a 1h respawn timer - nothing beats hordes of trash jumping you - while you are fighting a boss of course. Again an encounter that was designed quite ok, but the tuning was just horrible."

Source: http://nihilum.mousesports.com/en/article/...e_money_fails_/

Magtheridon was like that until SSC attunements were dropped, months into the game.. So Casual 25man raiders couldnt do anything as there was abolutly no learning curve.

Given how different our experiences for Magtheridon are, I'm not willing to argue this one out in detail (because so much of it is opinion). But if you go back and read the Gruul thread from elitist jerks (Titled "Dealing with Shatter" or something like that) you'll see a large portion of the raid community arguing that the fight is a consumable extravaganza and little else.

While luck certainly played some roll in the encounter (bad punts) dealing with shatter damage was the key mechanic: if you got lucky, great! but that wasn't the way you were expected to win.

Dont have to go find a source for this, as its the same as the previous one.

Luck was the only way to win on release version of gruul, as you always got to the point where Gruul could oneshot your tank regardless and just had to prey. That still isnt the point i was trying to make about learning curve's.. if the hardcore Vanilla WoW players were struggling to meet the enrage pushing all DPS to the maxiumum on the 2nd boss into the PvE content? wtf was the casual raiders meant to do.. just sit and wait.

At the start of TBC, content was just about banging your head on the wall until Blizzard nerfed it until it was properly. The only problem is that Blizzard realised they was screwing up and under tuned MH/BT when they were instances which could of got away with being overtuned.

Proficient

39 Thieves

Posted
Posted
Would you describe people who play a round of golf on Saturday and Sunday as "working a second job"? How about taking a trip to the ski hill every other weekend or too the race track every Wednesday and Friday night?

Why is it that when one person plays and has fun it's okay, when somebody else does and has more to show for it: it isn't?

Also, why wouldn't the millions of non-?ber players not start having fun in Naxx shortly after turning level 80 or becoming competitive in Arena? For me it'll be a rehash of content I did years ago but now with training wheels turned on, for them it could be new & interesting mechanics with a pile of story line to go with it.

Blizzard took away Sunwell: the only way I could have avoided this would be to start playing poorly, join a much less/slower progressing guild and wait for this patch. As for their being nothing challenging at 80: that's Blizzards fault. The encounters are now under tuned the same way Kara/gruul/mag were over tuned for introductory raids. Likewise Heroic 5-man content under tuned.

If you found Naxx-80 10-man as easy to clear as Karazhan after 3.0 would you find it a rewarding experience? Many people in this thread have stated that killing new bosses at any level of ?kael, illidan, <anything in sunwell>?didn't really have a sense of accomplishment. That's what everyone will be running in to if the level 80 content ships under-tuned.

What's funny is you act like WoW was hardd. It's a fun game,difficultt it has never been. Ever. Whatever though, may you find happiness in whatever endeavor entertains you.

Grand Master

the evn show

Posted
Posted
What's funny is you act like WoW was ever hard. It's a fun game, but difficult it has never been. Ever. Whatever though, may you find happiness in whatever endeavor entertains you.

Clearly there is some difficulty or the 99%+ raid guilds that cleared Karazhan would also have cleared Sunwell.

Grand Master

ANON86364

Posted
Posted
What's funny is you act like WoW was ever hard. It's a fun game, but difficult it has never been. Ever. Whatever though, may you find happiness in whatever endeavor entertains you.

We don't need to go through this again...the further you progress in the game, the harder it gets. If arena was "easy" I would have an amazing team/personal rating...I don't. If raiding was at all easy past Kara my guild would have cleared Mount Hyjal last night...we didn't.

Maybe for the people who stall out in Kara, it's a cake walk. Maybe for those who stall out in BGs they can pwn face. But if you keep pushing and progressing, you will find new and harder content.

Grand Master

Xilo

Posted
Posted
What's funny is you act like WoW was ever hard. It's a fun game, but difficult it has never been. Ever. Whatever though, may you find happiness in whatever endeavor entertains you.

Congratulations on never being in a progressing guild and rather be in one that has everything on farm mode and never having to experience PVP or PUGs. Of course nothing is going to be difficult when everything is basically handed to you on a silver platter...

Grand Master

Spyder Veteran

Posted
  • Veteran
Posted
That's what they plan to do:

I dunno, I'll be happy with these changes. Love the ret pally now. :p

They also said a bit about buffing Holy's damage as it seems to be low.

thanks for posting that! yea those changes would be fine by me too. i'm happy that what they're doing is exactly what i hoped they do - reduce the burst damage and take that reduction and spread it out over time. same dps, just in a longer period. sounds like pvp'ers should be happy by this so they don't owned in 3 seconds.

Experienced

I am Redbeard

Posted
Posted

Hahah yep.

What's funny about it is that I'm only 4/5 in MH and wiped enough times getting there that I'm exalted with Scale of the Sands.

It was a total cake walk, both Vashj and Kael.

I was doing 3k+ DPS with 3k+ Atkpwr at 31% crit rating

Volley is HUGE for AoE'ing as a hunter now. I saw another hunter in raid doing 5k+ but he was 4/8 t6.

Grand Master

the evn show

Posted
Posted
grats

Hand of A'dal!

While the official ruling is that you can't get the title any more, if you are on certain stages of the quest chain it's still possible.

Example: If you'd completed the BT attunement chain, but hadn't completed the Hyjal attunement you can still get the title provided you had the quest in your log already. They way no-title-for-you was implemented was by adding duplicate quests with identical rewards/text/etc. that all the NPCs now give out. They won't give out the old ones, but there is some speculation that if you have somebody share them you can still sneak your way into a title.

All the same: grats.

Grand Master

Slane

Posted
Posted
While the official ruling is that you can't get the title any more, if you are on certain stages of the quest chain it's still possible.

Example: If you'd completed the BT attunement chain, but hadn't completed the Hyjal attunement you can still get the title provided you had the quest in your log already. They way no-title-for-you was implemented was by adding duplicate quests with identical rewards/text/etc. that all the NPCs now give out. They won't give out the old ones, but there is some speculation that if you have somebody share them you can still sneak your way into a title.

All the same: grats.

I killed Vashj/Kael after patch. I did the BT attunment chain up to the part where you needed to talk to the guy in SSC. I just got my Medallion of Karabor, and got the title, Hand of A'dal. :)

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