New ban wave?

[Ricardo Gil]

Reading a couple of articles tutorials on how it all works does not mean you have too much time on your hands.

There, fixed.

[what]

There, fixed.

Umm, okay... doesn't look like you changed my point at all, but whatever. I'm sure you know more about what other people do than they do themselves.

[Kushan]

Reading a couple of articles on how it all works does not mean you have too much time on your hands.

It's what being a geek is all about!

[Sethos]

Well, you can look around various forums and find people you know, even Neowin members discussing these subjects in a "I-did-more-than-read-articles" manner :p

[Rudy]

I just backed it the hell up with a post from Major Nelson. I figure he knows more about it than you or I do. I don't know how you figure that just because only a handful of people are getting banned means that they can't tell the difference between a modded console and a regular console playing a review copy. That's bogus. It just means that perhaps they can't tell that some consoles are modded while others they can.

-Spenser

you didn't back it up at all, MS has no way to detect if a console is modded (otherwise ALL pirates would be banned). What they can do is detect badly ripped games and people playing games they shouldn't be playing....that's it

[Kushan]

Erm...not that I want to get into this debate, but surely since no legit 360's can play backup games, then it's logical to assume that if Microsoft detects a bad backup, they can deduce that your console has been illegally modified in order to play it?

[spenser.d]

you didn't back it up at all, MS has no way to detect if a console is modded (otherwise ALL pirates would be banned). What they can do is detect badly ripped games and people playing games they shouldn't be playing....that's it

Yes, but you're implying that they're banning people who are playing legit copies of games just because they got the game earlier than the street date, and that's not true.

-Spenser

[chrisj1968]

Well, if it IS a legit copy for backup purposes, then customers have a legal foot to stand on. what has been purposely forgotten in this world of piracy litigation by BIG business is, US law has a "fair use" law by which a user such as yourselves has a legal right to make 1(one) backup copy for archival purposes, should the original get ruined(keep the original disc) you can use the backup..legally. but BIG businesses like MS don't care. remember; Billy gates back in the days when MS first started made the statement that people steal(pirate) software anyway.

So if you ARE using a legit archival copy to play and you get banned, you need to inform MS about this neat and tidy law because they are violating your rights.

BTW, I this was a topic of discussion many years ago about piracy on another forum.

YOU ALL have a right to make 1 copy for archival purposes should your original disc go tango uniform.

[Hungarian Salami]

Why we get RRoDs? How MS detects who is playing pirated games? Two existential questions of the modern times :)

[spenser.d]

Well, if it IS a legit copy for backup purposes, then customers have a legal foot to stand on. what has been purposely forgotten in this world of piracy litigation by BIG business is, US law has a "fair use" law by which a user such as yourselves has a legal right to make 1(one) backup copy for archival purposes, should the original get ruined(keep the original disc) you can use the backup..legally. but BIG businesses like MS don't care. remember; Billy gates back in the days when MS first started made the statement that people steal(pirate) software anyway.

So if you ARE using a legit archival copy to play and you get banned, you need to inform MS about this neat and tidy law because they are violating your rights.

BTW, I this was a topic of discussion many years ago about piracy on another forum.

YOU ALL have a right to make 1 copy for archival purposes should your original disc got tango uniform.

Problem with your little 'loophole' as Kushan pointed out is that you can only run backup copies of games on modded consoles, and modding a console is illegal.

-Spenser

[Sethos]

Well, if it IS a legit copy for backup purposes, then customers have a legal foot to stand on. what has been purposely forgotten in this world of piracy litigation by BIG business is, US law has a "fair use" law by which a user such as yourselves has a legal right to make 1(one) backup copy for archival purposes, should the original get ruined(keep the original disc) you can use the backup..legally. but BIG businesses like MS don't care. remember; Billy gates back in the days when MS first started made the statement that people steal(pirate) software anyway.

So if you ARE using a legit archival copy to play and you get banned, you need to inform MS about this neat and tidy law because they are violating your rights.

BTW, I this was a topic of discussion many years ago about piracy on another forum.

YOU ALL have a right to make 1 copy for archival purposes should your original disc go tango uniform.

Yes but Microsoft aren't locking the 360's when banning but locking you out of THEIR service.

So backup all you want, you are still a 'guest' on Live.

[+Audioboxer Subscriber²]

Well, if it IS a legit copy for backup purposes, then customers have a legal foot to stand on. what has been purposely forgotten in this world of piracy litigation by BIG business is, US law has a "fair use" law by which a user such as yourselves has a legal right to make 1(one) backup copy for archival purposes, should the original get ruined(keep the original disc) you can use the backup..legally. but BIG businesses like MS don't care. remember; Billy gates back in the days when MS first started made the statement that people steal(pirate) software anyway.

So if you ARE using a legit archival copy to play and you get banned, you need to inform MS about this neat and tidy law because they are violating your rights.

BTW, I this was a topic of discussion many years ago about piracy on another forum.

YOU ALL have a right to make 1 copy for archival purposes should your original disc go tango uniform.

Um you can make as many backups of your 360 games as you want, MS won't care.

Where you step over the line for MS is when you modify their hardware.

If you aren't happy that you can't modify their hardware without repercussion, you should of read the T&C before using your 360, and returned it to the store if you weren't happy.

[Kushan]

Yeah, the 360 will still work, it just wont sign into Live, something Microsoft has every right to do. Incidentally, that's why they tend not to ban accounts, just consoles.

[Ricardo Gil]

Umm, okay... doesn't look like you changed my point at all, but whatever. I'm sure you know more about what other people do than they do themselves.

Chill man, you got me all wrong :laugh:

[chrisj1968]

Yes but Microsoft aren't locking the 360's when banning but locking you out of THEIR service.

So backup all you want, you are still a 'guest' on Live.

So that's just makes it more right for MS to ban accounts? you guys just proved a point I made to numerous friends a year or so ago...Corporate America is in charge...rights or no rights. ;)

[Sethos]

So that's just makes it more right for MS to ban accounts? you guys just proved a point I made to numerous friends a year or so ago...Corporate America is in charge...rights or no rights. ;)

They don't ban accounts! They ban the Xbox from going on Live.

You should plug up that failboat, seriously.

[gigapixels Veteran]

So that's just makes it more right for MS to ban accounts? you guys just proved a point I made to numerous friends a year or so ago...Corporate America is in charge...rights or no rights. ;)

Rights? It's their service. We're not talking about something like freedom of speech or freedom of religion. We're talking about them disallowing you from using their service if they find out you've been messing with their hardware. It's a pretty cut and dry issue.

By your logic, we don't have the right to kick people out of our own homes if they break a vase or do something else to **** us off. It's ridiculous.

[Kushan]

So that's just makes it more right for MS to ban accounts? you guys just proved a point I made to numerous friends a year or so ago...Corporate America is in charge...rights or no rights. ;)

They don't ban accounts, just modified hardware. Part of the T's and C's for Live is that you join it only using Microsoft's official hardware, unmodified. That's all they stop you from doing, connecting to live with a modified console. It's no different than you getting your car MOT'd to make sure it's road worthy, then taking out the breaks and having it taken off the road, even though you've paid your tax and insurance - you're still allowed to drive, just not in that car.

[chrisj1968]

They don't ban accounts, just modified hardware. Part of the T's and C's for Live is that you join it only using Microsoft's official hardware, unmodified. That's all they stop you from doing, connecting to live with a modified console. It's no different than you getting your car MOT'd to make sure it's road worthy, then taking out the breaks and having it taken off the road, even though you've paid your tax and insurance - you're still allowed to drive, just not in that car.

ok, ban modified hardware. got it. but not a "legit" back up of a game?

[spenser.d]

So that's just makes it more right for MS to ban accounts? you guys just proved a point I made to numerous friends a year or so ago...Corporate America is in charge...rights or no rights. ;)

Of course it's right for MS to ban accounts. Did you not take notice of the fact that you have to mod your console to use a backup? Also, you have to agree to their ToS for XBL, which says they can ban your account for any reason. If you don't agree to that, you don't use XBL. It's pretty simple and it's not like they're forcing you to agree to the ToS. I don't know how that leads to corporate America being in charge, though.

-Spenser

[chrisj1968]

Rights? It's their service. We're not talking about something like freedom of speech or freedom of religion. We're talking about them disallowing you from using their service if they find out you've been messing with their hardware. It's a pretty cut and dry issue.

By your logic, we don't have the right to kick people out of our own homes if they break a vase or do something else to **** us off. It's ridiculous.

whoa!, I'm not trying to pee in your pool mate, just trying to have a civil discussion. I got your point. so I'm understanding NOW, that you are NOT really buying the console rather, leasing it under terms and conditions set forth by said corporation..Microsoft?

then yeah, I agree with you. but I responded originally to posts that I think said that people were getting bumped/banned/locked out because of bad disc copies. but yeah we are on the same sheet of music.

[gigapixels Veteran]

It's not a lease. You own the console. You don't however own any "rights" to use a modified console on Live. It's a privilege, and if you break their terms they kick that modified console off.

[chrisj1968]

ok. well as you can guess i don't have an xbox360 and I don't plan on buying one. I might get a PS3 or a wii.

[Sethos]

Yeah, go create some personal backups of PS3 games (Y)

Oh wait, better sue them.

[+Audioboxer Subscriber²]

ok. well as you can guess i don't have an xbox360 and I don't plan on buying one. I might get a PS3 or a wii.

Don't expect Sony to treat you any differently once their system gets compromised. Pretty much guaranteed they'll ban the mac address of the console as well.

As for Nintendo, they couldn't give two hoots about their "online" service.