F1 World Championship 2009 Thread

[Subject Delta]

Well after 2012, they will have no choice if he chooses not to re-sign. Personally I think the relationship is repairable but its certainly a tough time for all in the silver team at the moment.

[Mike]

Well Brawn are fast at the moment, but they are still a new team, I think Lewis will wait to see the new pecking order establish itself before he signs for any team

I wish people would stop calling them a new team, what exactly is new except the funding sources and name? The car was developed by Honda for over a year, the team consists of a large chunk of the Honda crew. Only new thing is the Merc engine.

He is actually on a contract with them until 2012, but after all the hard work and money McLaren have put into him they would not let him go easily.

He could easily claim breach of contract due to what has happened and be free of McLaren if he so wished, but I'm not sure he will

[Subject Delta]

I wish people would stop calling them a new team, what exactly is new except the funding sources and name? The car was developed by Honda for over a year, the team consists of a large chunk of the Honda crew. Only new thing is the Merc engine.

Well technically they are new, but the point is that without Honda's backing he would still want to wait to see how things establish themselves before he decides his future

[Nicholas-c Veteran]

i thought that Honda handed over plans, staff etc to Brawn, i believe Ross Brawn said in an Australian GP Interview that 18/9 months ago when he saw the honda plans he completely scrapped it ?

New name, New Funding, New contracts, New Senior staff, New engine, New Aerodynamics, New Chassis(maybe) among other things, New team in my books :p

[Subject Delta]

No new aerodynamics, Honda developed this Car, Brawn just inherited it. I believe most of the senior staff are the same, if anything has changed it is probably operational

[Crazysah]

Is it true that Honda were sold for 1 pound and something?

[Subject Delta]

The team wasn't their facilities where I believe, it was a ploy to make it a more financially attractive investment. Without having to spend out ridiculous amounts of money on the facilities the buyer could keep the team racing. That's my understanding of the situation anyway

[+Frank B. Subscriber²]

FIA declares double diffusers legal

The FIA International Court of Appeal has declared the double-decker diffuser designs used by Brawn GP, Toyota and Williams as legal.

Following overnight deliberation by the judges after a court hearing in Paris on Tuesday, the ICA has rejected the appeals lodged by Ferrari, Red Bull Racing, Renault. BMW Sauber and McLaren had also entered the appeal as affected parties.

A statement issued by the FIA on Wednesday morning said: "The FIA International Court of Appeal has decided to deny the appeals submitted against decisions numbered 16 to 24 taken by the Panel of the Stewards on 26 March at the 2009 Grand Prix of Australia and counting towards the 2009 FIA Formula One World Championship.

"Based on the arguments heard and evidence before it, the Court has concluded that the Stewards were correct to find that the cars in question comply with the applicable regulations."

The ICA's decision is a blow to those teams that did not pursue the design concept when they created their 2009 cars - as it is widely accepted that the double-decker diffusers have brought a performance advantage.

Ferrari's Kimi Raikkonen suggested last week that the diffuser decision would be vital for the outcome of the world title - with his team likely to have to wait for several races before being able to fit a suitable one to their car.

"The FIA's Court of Appeal will decide about the diffuser and this decision will have an enormous impact on the championship," Raikkonen said.

"We're missing grip and downforce. You just need to analyse the performance in the three sectors at Sepang to understand that we're losing a lot compared to the best cars. You could see it especially in the middle sector where downforce is really crucial.

The row over the diffusers has also led to intense confrontation between the rival factions ? with Brawn GP team principal Ross Brawn being on the receiving end of attacks from Renault and Ferrari about his use of the diffuser concept.

However, he has stood firm in his belief that the design was legal ? and confirmed recently that he offered rivals the chance to close off the regulations to prevent teams exploiting the diffuser designs, but they rejected the opportunity.

"In March 2008 that was offered," said Brawn, when asked by AUTOSPORT about the matter.

"If I'm frank I didn't say 'look we are going to do this diffuser if you don't accept this rule' because I'm not going to tell people what we're doing, but I explained that I felt that we should have a different set of rules to simplify what needs to be done.

"I offered them and they were rejected, so my conscience is very clear. And those rules that I put on the table would have stopped a lot of things. It would have stopped the diffuser, it would have stopped all those bargeboards around the front, and it would have cleaned the cars up.

"Because it was clear that when we started to work on the regulations that there were things that you could do, and we needed to perhaps clean them up, but nobody was interested. They are interested now."[/quoSource: Autosport

Hallelujah. Now let's concentrate on racing again, mmk?

[Biohead]

Thank god for that!

[Dark_ph0enix]

So 'tis official - Jenson ftw for every race this season :)

[Subject Delta]

A victory for common sense. Finally a decision coming out of the FIA that doesn't leave me scratching my head and wondering precisely what they where smoking.

[Nicholas-c Veteran]

Apparently renault already have a defusser ready to go for this weekend so I imagine Ferrari, McLaren and co, all the big teams will have them done.

[CrashG]

Thank god for that!

A victory for common sense. Finally a decision coming out of the FIA that doesn't leave me scratching my head and wondering precisely what they where smoking.

:yes:

Now all the other teams that don't have these diffusers will be in a mad rush to get them on their cars. :laugh:

[san.W10]

So BRAWN will PWN this season :p

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Theissen: Diffusers will hurt overtaking

BMW Motorsport director Mario Theissen has warned that the FIA's decision to approve the diffusers on the Brawn, Williams and Toyota cars will keep Formula 1 from reaching the intended reduction in downforce levels this season.

BMW-Sauber was one of several teams to appeal against the double-decker diffusers, but the International Court of Appeal today approved the designs and BMW has joined Ferrari and Red Bull in admitting it will have to re-design its diffuser.

"We will accept the decision of the International Court of Appeal," said Theissen. "This ruling means we now have clarity regarding the application of the regulations.

"However, it does not achieve the reduction in downforce and cornering speeds intended by the Overtaking Working Group when the new regulations were drawn up. At the same time, this decision means that seven teams will have to invest heavily in carrying out the necessary modifications to their cars."

http://www.autosport.com/news/report.php/id/74485

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[CrashG]

"We will accept the decision of the International Court of Appeal," said Theissen. "This ruling means we now have clarity regarding the application of the regulations.

"However, it does not achieve the reduction in downforce and cornering speeds intended by the Overtaking Working Group when the new regulations were drawn up. At the same time, this decision means that seven teams will have to invest heavily in carrying out the necessary modifications to their cars."

Had the rules not been so vague as to lead to various interpretations of them, this wouldn't be an issue in the first place. Make the rules clear cut next time where there is no room for discussion. ;)

[Subject Delta]

Apparently renault already have a defusser ready to go for this weekend so I imagine Ferrari, McLaren and co, all the big teams will have them done.

My guess is Renault's new diffuser may be an interim design, I would be surprised if they got the full benifit from it without a full rear end redesign.

Now all the other teams that don't have these diffusers will be in a mad rush to get them on their cars. :laugh:

No kidding, and its gonna leave Ferrari and particularly McLaren with a lot more headscratching. Ferrari may come to the front later on in the season, but I will be surprised if McLaren even win a single race, and I believe the diffuser ruling essentially ends the title hopes of both teams unless they can come up with something exceptional in record time

[CrashG]

No kidding, and its gonna leave Ferrari and particularly McLaren with a lot more headscratching. Ferrari may come to the front later on in the season, but I will be surprised if McLaren even win a single race, and I believe the diffuser ruling essentially ends the title hopes of both teams unless they can come up with something exceptional in record time

Yeah, I think both teams are probably out of the running for winning the constructors championship this season, unless they come up with something very good and very quick (without breaking any rules :p). They both have the resources and talented people to make it happen though, only time will tell.

I think Ferrari have more to worry about than just the diffuser though. If you can't finish a race, speed means nothing. :laugh:

[Subject Delta]

Yep, their reliability seems to have gotten progressively worse since the "dream team" left at the end of 2006. Something I am struggling to work out as Ferrari to me have always been the model of Diligence and professionalism, and their procedural side has certainly slipped of late. If it wasn't for that, Massa would have had the title last year.

The face of F1 has certainly changed since Schumi left.

For the record, I wouldn't be surprised if McLaren are looking at another WCC expulsion anyway after their lying shenanigans... Something going wrong procedurally for them as well (in a big way) :laugh:

[CrashG]

Yep, their reliability seems to have gotten progressively worse since the "dream team" left at the end of 2006. Something I am struggling to work out as Ferrari to me have always been the model of Diligence and professionalism, and their procedural side has certainly slipped of late. If it wasn't for that, Massa would have had the title last year.

The face of F1 has certainly changed since Schumi left.

For the record, I wouldn't be surprised if McLaren are looking at another WCC expulsion anyway after their lying shenanigans... Something going wrong procedurally for them as well (in a big way) :laugh:

Yeah, they were solid back then that's for sure. Hopefully they can get their act together... soon.

I really hope McLaren don't get excluded... again. It really ruins the sport. I hope the FIA doesn't make some crap decision and take McLaren out of the fight. Give them a monetary fine or something.

I've said it before, Yes I am a Ferrari fan, but I'm a bigger fan for good hard honest racing.

To the FIA & race stewards: Can we please keep the drama on-track? :p

[Subject Delta]

You're a bit more fair minded than a lot of the European Ferrari fans thats for sure. To be honest I think we have had enough courtroom agruments already, time for the racing to do the talking.

[CrashG]

You're a bit more fair minded than a lot of the European Ferrari fans thats for sure. To be honest I think we have had enough courtroom agruments already, time for the racing to do the talking.

I'm pretty fair minded about a lot of things, racing just happens to fit into it. :laugh:

I like competition, when Ferrari was 1-2 every single race a few years back, although being a fan, it wasn't that exciting. I'm all for the person/team that has the fastest car and does a perfect drive, they deserve to win that day, doesn't matter who it is or who they drive for. I'm a racing fan first and foremost, a Ferrai fan second. :)

[Shibby]

I'm sure Mclaren have already been working on one anyway, they didn't take part with the other teams in calling it illegal, tell you the truth I can't remember if Force India did either. Mostly because Brawn GP and Force India get technical stuff from Mclaren, so maybe thats why they were quiet, in a way support Brawn GP.

[san.W10]

KERS runners:

imo mclaren might beat ferrari, coz they have a car which has finished two races.

in schumi era, ferrari had total of 1 or 2 reliability issues in 2-3 seasons.

wth is goin on in the team now?

can Brawn+todt combo be the reason?

[CrashG]

KERS runners:

imo mclaren might beat ferrari, coz they have a car which has finished two races.

in schumi era, ferrari had total of 1 or 2 reliability issues in 2-3 seasons.

wth is goin on in the team now?

can Brawn+todt combo be the reason?

That could very well be the reason. :yes:

It's been quite some time that the Ferrari's were unreliable, of course so has McLaren, they've just had problems (with certain individual/s) inside the team

[Mike]

A victory for common sense. Finally a decision coming out of the FIA that doesn't leave me scratching my head and wondering precisely what they where smoking.

Doesn't explain why Red Bull had their similarly designed diffuser declared illegal by the FIA when they were first designing it now does it? ;)

There are a few teams that started work on the diffusers pre-season yet all decided it wasn't legal/what the rules meant and so scrapped them, probably when Red Bull's were classed as illegal.

I'm sure Mclaren have already been working on one anyway, they didn't take part with the other teams in calling it illegal, tell you the truth I can't remember if Force India did either. Mostly because Brawn GP and Force India get technical stuff from Mclaren, so maybe thats why they were quiet, in a way support Brawn GP.

McLaren were present but only in an observation aspect, probably didn't want to be seen as trying to go against the stewards. Force India didn't protest for 'political reasons', probably didn't feel right to protest established teams when they're kinda new. Toro Rosso didn't take part either but that's because they're essentially Red Bull and so no need for them to take part.