PlayStation 3 Slim/Price Cut set for TGS according to PSW

[ahhell]

I heard they're removing 360 BC this time around.

Wait, you guys didn't know? If you put the 360 DVD in upside down it plays the 360 games at half the frame rate and with 20% less resolution!

I'm sorry but what the **** does that have to do with this thread.

You're the one that's always going off about people getting off topic.

I asked a legitimate question as Sony is notorious for removing features to save a buck.

[+Audioboxer Subscriber²]

I'm sorry but what the **** does that have to do with this thread.

You're the one that's always going off about people getting off topic.

I asked a legitimate question as Sony is notorious for removing features to save a buck.

I answered your question.

[gigapixels Veteran]

Keep it on topic. No need to start an argument.

[Kushan]

I heard they're removing 360 BC this time around.

Wait, you guys didn't know? If you put the 360 DVD in upside down it plays the 360 games at half the frame rate and with 20% less resolution!

On a serious note, only rumour of removal so far is other operating system support (Linux), which seems unfounded as that's fully software based support, nothing hardware wise to remove to discontinue support. The source that rumour comes from says nothing else is being removed except internal nuts and bolts that don't affect us.

Something I've always wondered about: Sony loses money on every PS3 purchased, right? They make their money back through sales of games - that's a well known fact. But we always see stories of labs and departments buying loads of PS3s and networking them together as a cluster to form a rather cheap, but effective supercomputer. Well, how does Sony make ANY money from this?

I mean, I've seen pictures of labs with literally hundreds of PS3s all tied together I very much doubt that they're also used for COD.

If the rumour is true that Sony needs to sell 5 games to make a profit, then that's like 500 extra games they need to sell. Sounds to me like it's not inconceivable for Sony to remove OtherOS support, at least in the meantime.

[Huleboeren]

I wonder what kind of features Sony will strip out to make the slim.

What? The PS2 Slim added a ethernet port the PS2 Fat did not have

[+Audioboxer Subscriber²]

Something I've always wondered about: Sony loses money on every PS3 purchased, right? They make their money back through sales of games - that's a well known fact. But we always see stories of labs and departments buying loads of PS3s and networking them together as a cluster to form a rather cheap, but effective supercomputer. Well, how does Sony make ANY money from this?

I mean, I've seen pictures of labs with literally hundreds of PS3s all tied together I very much doubt that they're also used for COD.

If the rumour is true that Sony needs to sell 5 games to make a profit, then that's like 500 extra games they need to sell. Sounds to me like it's not inconceivable for Sony to remove OtherOS support, at least in the meantime.

Who said that?

And labs buying loads of PS3s and networking them will be few and far between. It's not like 2 million of the install base is sold to labs. In these cases anyway depending on what the labs are researching they could be offering other deals with Sony such as percentages in the projects or whatever, I doubt they were clear cut buying 100 PS3s at $500/600 a pop.

I mean, even the Warhawk devs were allowed a load of PS3s for the dedicated online servers

It isn't inconceivable for Sony to remove OtherOS support, but I still don't think much of the rumour yet. Can't you find out anyway? :p

edit: Apparently these sources are saying ready for sale IN summer :blink: http://japan.internet.com/finanews/20090630/5.html and http://udn.com/NEWS/STOCK/STO3/4990039.shtml When is the next games conferenced? August?

[soniqstylz]

What? The PS2 Slim added a ethernet port the PS2 Fat did not have

..but lost HDD support in the process.

And as I posted in the 3.0 thread, removing OtherOS support would also help streamline the XMB and memory management, no?

[Kushan]

Who said that?

And labs buying loads of PS3s and networking them will be few and far between. It's not like 2 million of the install base is sold to labs. In these cases anyway depending on what the labs are researching they could be offering other deals with Sony such as percentages in the projects or whatever, I doubt they were clear cut buying 100 PS3s at $500/600 a pop.

I mean, even the Warhawk devs were allowed a load of PS3s for the dedicated online servers

It isn't inconceivable for Sony to remove OtherOS support, but I still don't think much of the rumour yet. Can't you find out anyway? :p

edit: Apparently these sources are saying ready for sale IN summer :blink: http://japan.internet.com/finanews/20090630/5.html and http://udn.com/NEWS/STOCK/STO3/4990039.shtml When is the next games conferenced? August?

You'd be surprised. Don't think of it in terms of blowing $50,000 for the sake of it, think of it in terms of what $50,000 gets you, computationally. A similarly priced machine from the likes of IBM wouldn't be anywhere near as powerful for floating point operations (i.e. the kinds of operations scientists use). Considering the power behind that many PS3s, $50,000 is actually quite a bargain.

That's kind of what I'm getting at, of all the PS3 owners out there, how many actually make good use of OtherOS support AND buy games?

The "Sony needs to sell 5 games per PS3" thing is quite an old statement, but I believe that figure was accurate back in the PS2 days and the PS3 costs a lot more. Even if it's not 5 games, even if it's only 1 or 2, it still stands to reason, a PS3 bought strictly for "OtherOS" usage isn't ever going to make Sony any money. I think from a strictly business point of view, that rumour makes a lot of sense, "OtherOS" doesn't ever make Sony money, but it can often cost them money, so remove it. Particularly as it seems this PS3 Slim, if it's real (I ain't commenting either way) according to the rumours is strictly a cost-cutting plan by Sony, it adds even more weight to it.

I guess we'll have to wait and see what happens.

P.S. Maxconsole doesn't like hotlinking =P

[TDQuiksilver]

Silver slim PS3... *crosses fingers*

[+Audioboxer Subscriber²]

Kotaku running the story now

PS3 Slim Entering Production, Ready By July

According to Chinese site UDN, Sony have signed production contracts with two companies to begin manufacture of the rumoured PS3 "Slim", with a delivery date of...oh, next month!

Now, with a PS3 price cut heavily expected around August, and with stocks of the existing 80GB PS3 supposedly dwindling, a July delivery date for the "new" PS3 makes sense. Ship it out in July, have it ready to sell in stores for August.

That is, if it's real. Which, remember, it may not be!

Source: http://kotaku.com/5305021/ps3-slim-enterin...n-ready-by-july

The Games Convention is the 31st of July to the 2nd of August :shifty: - http://www.gamesconvention.com/

In the past I think PSP hardware has been announced there, and I know for definite PlayTV was unveiled there. European event, PS3 probably has it's largest install base in Europe, would be a good time to cut the price/announce Slim.

Then they can show off GT5 at TGS in September :p

[mokthraka]

IMO the ps3 slim is ugly

[+Audioboxer Subscriber²]

IMO the ps3 slim is ugly

You should wait to see the actual console, not cell phone pictures of questionable validity (prototype/incomplete/not even real?). The leaks look far from hot, but I have no doubts they're far from finished produce off a production line if they are real.

[Gotenks98]

..but lost HDD support in the process.

Doesnt really matter when there were like only 2 games that used the hdd. Resident Evil online and Final Fantasy.

[soniqstylz]

Doesnt really matter when there were like only 2 games that used the hdd. Resident Evil online and Final Fantasy.

I bet you would have seen more if Sony had supported it more. MS didn't have the in-game music patent yet.

[scrimpy32]

can't wait

there probably going to have this priced higher than the unslim and lower the price of the original and then cycle through and lower the slim, then the ps4

PS4 will come out in about 6 - 8 years if you listen to sony

[Xero]

Anxious to see the new model, and the price cut is long overdue. Wonder how big of an impact on sales it will have.

[Smigit]

PS4 will come out in about 6 - 8 years if you listen to sony

When did they say that? Those time lines would fit in with their "10 year life span" but as everyone knows, Sony releases the next gen before they release they cut off support to the successor. I'd say it'll be sooner than 6 years and certainly not as much as 8. The market will have moved on by then, especially given they haven't had the same foot hold they had with the PS1 and PS2.

[Kushan]

I bet you would have seen more if Sony had supported it more. MS didn't have the in-game music patent yet.

Why do people keep spreading this silly rumour? The PS3 DOES do in-game music, it just doesn't do it very well. It's up to developers to support it and most don't bother because it can create a whole bunch of extra issues they have to deal with (slowdowns, glitches, audio corruption). Microsoft built it into the 360 from the off and made sure that it didn't interfere with anything else. Essentially, Microsoft's implementation is much much better.

I don't know why people bring up that patent thing, it's rediculous, clearly if that patent was actually a factor, then NO game on the PS3 would support ingame music, but a few actually do. What makes them so special?

[Ricardo Gil]

Why do people keep spreading this silly rumour? The PS3 DOES do in-game music, it just doesn't do it very well. It's up to developers to support it and most don't bother because it can create a whole bunch of extra issues they have to deal with (slowdowns, glitches, audio corruption). Microsoft built it into the 360 from the off and made sure that it didn't interfere with anything else. Essentially, Microsoft's implementation is much much better.

I don't know why people bring up that patent thing, it's rediculous, clearly if that patent was actually a factor, then NO game on the PS3 would support ingame music, but a few actually do. What makes them so special?

I've stated here countless times before that the patent MS holds is about assigning custom playlists for games, not In-game music in general. Their patent describes how to (as an example) automatically play Rock music when you boot up Halo, or Thriller during a GoW session. No one bothered to read it I guess.

[+Audioboxer Subscriber²]

Why do people keep spreading this silly rumour? The PS3 DOES do in-game music, it just doesn't do it very well. It's up to developers to support it and most don't bother because it can create a whole bunch of extra issues they have to deal with (slowdowns, glitches, audio corruption). Microsoft built it into the 360 from the off and made sure that it didn't interfere with anything else. Essentially, Microsoft's implementation is much much better.

I don't know why people bring up that patent thing, it's rediculous, clearly if that patent was actually a factor, then NO game on the PS3 would support ingame music, but a few actually do. What makes them so special?

The patent argument is that MS own a patent for universal implementation of an in-game music system through the operating system. The way for Sony to get around that was leave it up to developers to include support on a per-game basis on their own behalf therefore meaning Sony aren't infringing on MS' universal system. PS3 developers are implementing custom music support in their games, not Sony. MS couldn't file a patent to stop developers doing it.

The developers of Super Star Dust HD had custom music support before Sony even released firmware 2.4 (the firmware that brought in-game XMB).

Sony may have already found a loophole in the patent to allow them to provide custom soundtracks for particular games, as long as the functionality is not system-wide. In this way they could avoid the patent. Microsoft could charge Sony for the privilege, but it would be a lot of wasted effort to patent this particular feature and then allow competitors to implement it. Therefore, when Sony’s in-game XMB eventually comes around, custom soundtracks might be left on the cutting room floor. It will all depend on how constricting the patent actually is, and how kind Microsoft are feeling. Reasons for the in-game XMB delay may be found here - Sony are trying their best to get custom soundtracks installed legally.

You can't keep shouting at us when it's news sites documenting the patent that way - http://www.ripten.com/2008/03/31/microsoft...om-soundtracks/

[Kushan]

I've stated here countless times before that the patent MS holds is about assigning custom playlists for games, not In-game music in general. Their patent describes how to (as an example) automatically play Rock music when you boot up Halo, or Thriller during a GoW session. No one bothered to read it I guess.

Perhaps, but considering that Sony can't seem to get ingame music working for the vast majority of their games, I'd bet that play-lists are the least of their priorities.

Edit: AB: That would all make sense, except for the titles that DO play music, it's done through the XMB still.

[+Audioboxer Subscriber²]

Perhaps, but considering that Sony can't seem to get ingame music working for the vast majority of their games, I'd bet that play-lists are the least of their priorities.

Edit: AB: That would all make sense, except for the titles that DO play music, it's done through the XMB still.

Yes but it's a per-game basis, it's not a universal system. Developers have to actively code their game to support custom music, there's no code in the PS3 firmware that mutes a game and plays custom music over the top of it unless the game has been coded to support it.

It's my understanding you can play custom music over any 360 game.

[Elessar]

Doesnt really matter when there were like only 2 games that used the hdd. Resident Evil online and Final Fantasy.

And SOCOM, and SOCOM 2, SOCOM 3, and Sims 2, as well as other popular titles...but yeah, I used a USB stick instead.

[Kushan]

Yes but it's a per-game basis, it's not a universal system. Developers have to actively code their game to support custom music, there's no code in the PS3 firmware that mutes a game and plays custom music over the top of it unless the game has been coded to support it.

It's my understanding you can play custom music over any 360 game.

The 360 is no different in its operation, the difference is that its a requirement from Microsoft that developers support it. After all, how does the 360 know the difference between say..a stream of ingame music and a stream of sound effects? The 360's OS tells the game to stop playing music. The developer then does whatever they need to do to stop said music until the 360 says it's ok to play it again. The PS3, for the few titles that do work, is exactly the same with the exception that it's not mandatory and it's not mandatory because half the time, it doesn't work very well.

[+Audioboxer Subscriber²]

The 360 is no different in its operation, the difference is that its a requirement from Microsoft that developers support it. After all, how does the 360 know the difference between say..a stream of ingame music and a stream of sound effects? The 360's OS tells the game to stop playing music. The developer then does whatever they need to do to stop said music until the 360 says it's ok to play it again. The PS3, for the few titles that do work, is exactly the same with the exception that it's not mandatory and it's not mandatory because half the time, it doesn't work very well.

Kushan I don't know why you're struggling to get this :p

It's not about how it finally ends up working on the PS3, it's that according to beliefs behind the patent Sony can't do it automatically for each game because that would endure a universal system like what MS has in place, and infringe on the patent. The SDK or whatever for 360 development probably has had a "switch" or piece of code from the start that understands what/where the stream of audio getting passed from the disc to console is for every single game due to how the operating system handles it.

I'm no experienced coder, so excuse the patched together terminology.

If we are to believe how the patent is interpreted the only way Sony can give us in-game music is to let developers completely code everything on their end, when you go to the XMB to play music it's the game stopping it's own audio, not the PS3 with some universal command. Which explains why different games on the PS3 have different ways of doing in-game music.

Burnout for example requires you to go through their own system in-game, other games you can just bring up the XMB and start a song.

The PS3 has been able to play MP3s from day one, all the OS is doing is using that feature, it's the PS3 games that are pausing audio and overlaying the music on top of themselves whilst running for in-game music which avoids stepping on the patent.