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Live Discussion: Apple's iPad 2 event

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PyX    140

You might want to brush up on Mac history first. My point might make more sense to you then.

Wow, sorry if I said 10 years instead of 9. As if it changed the whole thing... eMac parts 9 years later cost a lot more to do than their actual value on the market. Can you say that of an iPod Touch? The price on NAND Flash memory hasn't dropped a lot in the last 3 years and R&D has lead us next to nowhere to lower them or increase the capacity.

On the other hand, I suspect Apple's profit margin to be high enough that they could have doubled the capacity in these beasts while still being profitable; but they would have to sacrifice a great profit margin for a correct one, losing between $20 and $50 of profit per iPad sold.

By the way, it always makes me laugh when iFixIt tears down an Apple product and then come with what they call the value of the product. The iPad can have for $150 of hardware inside, if you calculate things correctly you may end up that it is worth $300 and being sold to people at $499.

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.Neo    1,834

Like I said before: Brush up on Mac history. The eMac was still being sold halfway through 2006. (Y)

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threetonesun    1,204

That's a different discussion altogether.

Being an Android phone owner myself I have to say applications on iOS are way ahead of pretty much anything on Google's platform. They tend to have much nicer and better interfaces, more functionality and are overall less buggy (although your milage might vary there). I really don't find Android apps to be that good.

The iPad sets itself apart from regular laptops and netbooks with its portability, battery life and overall it's very low-maintence compared to running a desktop OS.

A discussion had by Apple's marketing and business departments, no doubt. They know the majority of their consumers are not going to complain about a 16GBs of storage.

And yes, iOS apps are great. I have an iPhone, it's iOS + a phone, it fits in my pocket and goes with me everywhere. The iPad does not fit this criteria. It is more convenient than a netbook, until you have to lug a keyboard around with it. So I stand behind what I said, there still isn't a "killer app" that differentiates it from a PC, nor makes it more useful/different than the small iOS devices.

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PyX    140

Like I said before: Brush up on Mac history. The eMac was still being sold halfway through 2006. (Y)

I believe I'm not the only one who needs to brush up his Mac history. Its production stopped in October 2005, I doubt there was still one of these being sold in June 2006. ;)

It does not change the fact that every possible computer component has seen its price going down a LOT in the last 6 year. Why? Because we manage to develop much better hardware year after year. NAND Flash has not seen incredible price drops in the last 3 years, because its development is nearly stalled.

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.Neo    1,834
And yes, iOS apps are great. I have an iPhone, it's iOS + a phone, it fits in my pocket and goes with me everywhere. The iPad does not fit this criteria. It is more convenient than a netbook, until you have to lug a keyboard around with it. So I stand behind what I said, there still isn't a "killer app" that differentiates it from a PC, nor makes it more useful/different than the small iOS devices.

For me Pages would make it worthwhile compared to an iPhone or iPod touch. I don't own a laptop and netbooks really aren't doing it for me. So when it comes to that the iPad would be a perfect solution. It's all about size, portability and overall user-friendliness compared to a regular laptop or netbook.

I believe I'm not the only one who needs to brush up his Mac history. Its production stopped in October 2005, I doubt there was still one of these being sold in June 2006. ;)

Apple released its latest eMac model mid 2005 and stores continued selling it all the way through June 2006. In fact the store I worked for received new shipments in February or March 2006, just before I left. You can doubt that all you want, but that doesn't make it less true. And no matter how you spin it even October 2005 is still nowhere near the 10 years you kept talking about.

Good to see you finally found the Wikipedia page btw. ;)

It does not change the fact that every possible computer component has seen its price going down a LOT in the last 6 year. Why? Because we manage to develop much better hardware year after year. NAND Flash has not seen incredible price drops in the last 3 years, because its development is nearly stalled.

It has seen price drops though in three years. It has more to do with production volumes rather than development and with Apple being one of the biggest buyers prices drop even more.

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PyX    140

Good to see you finally found the Wikipedia page btw. ;)

I guess you were asking for it... :whistle:

It has seen price drops though in three years. It has more to do with production volumes rather than development and with Apple being one of the biggest buyers prices drop even more.

Actually, a lot of companies are mad at Apple because they monopolize too many chips, others don?t stand a chance to buy exactly what they want :laugh:

But yeah, I?m not saying it hasn?t seen price drops, it certainly did like everything in this world. But it?s probably THE component in the entire electronic industry that has seen the slowest price drops in the last 3 years.

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Vice    1,593

New iPad looks really nice I love the cover design they've done with the magnets.

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.Neo    1,834

I guess you were asking for it... :whistle:

And even then we have to come to the conclusion it's still nowhere near 10 years ago. :whistle:

But yeah, I?m not saying it hasn?t seen price drops, it certainly did like everything in this world. But it?s probably THE component in the entire electronic industry that has seen the slowest price drops in the last 3 years.

What are you basing that on if you don mind my asking? As far as I'm concerned it's more about Apple wanting bigger profit margins.

New iPad looks really nice I love the cover design they've done with the magnets.

The thing is I'm more concerned about the back getting scratched than the front. :/ Looking at my almost 3-yo iPod touch the screen is next to impossible to scratch. The back on the other hand...

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Vice    1,593

NAND flash prices have dropped but you won't be able to notice that in Apples products because they don't price based on component costs they price based on market research on what numbers people are most likely to pay for a product. I mean obviously component prices will be the bare minimum price that they begin selling stuff at but usually you tack on 50-60% on to that to get Apples retail pricing, they like healthy margins just like any company.

Since 2009 NAND prices have fallen about 50%. Tracking individual chip prices is a bit more difficult but the best way to get a realistic representation is looking at Solid State Drives from budget makers who always keep their margins razer thin. And if we do that back in 2009 100GB of NAND was about $500 and today it's about $250 so from 2009 to today the price fell 50%.

I'd say some of the reason the price hasn't completely bottomed out is due to collusion among NAND producers (which has been found and the companies have had to pay fines for it) as-well as a huge demand which has outstripped supply and large deals for fixed prices like Apple does where they pay 3 billion dollars to get x amount of NAND flash upfront.

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PyX    140

And even then we have to come to the conclusion it's still nowhere near 10 years ago. :whistle:

Yet we both agree that through the last 5-6 years, prices of every component in your eMac dropped dramatically, unlike NAND flash.

What are you basing that on if you don mind my asking? As far as I'm concerned it's more about Apple wanting bigger profit margins.

I read a lot about Apple on French websites and unlike English sites like MacRumors, they talk a lot about NAND Flash.

Take a look at this graph for example :

SSD%20price%20graph.jpg

Report Price Hikes Killing SSD Sales for Laptops : http://www.computerworld.com/s/article/9135314/Report_Price_hikes_killing_SSD_sales_for_laptops

Another good article about SSDs :

Why Aren?t SSDs Getting Cheaper : http://www.computerworld.com/s/article/print/9175690/Why_aren_t_SSDs_getting_cheaper_

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Elliott    235

The thing is I'm more concerned about the back getting scratched than the front. :/ Looking at my almost 3-yo iPod touch the screen is next to impossible to scratch. The back on the other hand...

The back of the iPad 2 is anodized aluminum; not the stainless steel that the iPod touch has. I doubt it'll get scratched very easily.

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PyX    140

The back of the iPad 2 is anodized aluminum; not the stainless steel that the iPod touch has. I doubt it'll get scratched very easily.

Does it have anything to do with their purchase of Liquid Metal? If they?re using this, it?s great :woot:

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Stetson    180

Does it have anything to do with their purchase of Liquid Metal? If they?re using this, it?s great :woot:

Nope, same aluminum they've been using on Macbook Pros and the previous iPad I believe. The video though seemed to show actual CNC cut unibody manufacturing for the back case, as opposed to the iPad 1 which was just stamped. That's probably part of how they made it thinner, since all of the internal supports and anchor points etc. can just be machined into the back case.

Edit: Here's a screenshot. They also show this fading in from a solid block of aluminum and mention unibody manufacturing, so it looks like these are being CNC cut like the Macbooks.

post-182672-0-68624300-1299177438.jpg

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DavidM    329

Has anyone got an amount of ram in these yet? I can't understand why they haven't listed it in the "tech specs" on their own site, they list the amount of memory in every other device they sell.

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vhane    94

Has anyone got an amount of ram in these yet? I can't understand why they haven't listed it in the "tech specs" on their own site, they list the amount of memory in every other device they sell.

My guess is that it has less RAM than the competition. Otherwise they would list it in the specs. iPad 2 probably has 512MB.

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PyX    140

My guess is that it has less RAM than the competition. Otherwise they would list it in the specs. iPad 2 probably has 512MB.

...and he gets away by saying the competition has 1GB :laugh:

Or maybe by competition he meant the Xoom?

I believe the bottleneck of the iPad is its limited capacity way before its memory.

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Stetson    180

Has anyone got an amount of ram in these yet? I can't understand why they haven't listed it in the "tech specs" on their own site, they list the amount of memory in every other device they sell.

Only for standard Intel platform computers. No iPhones, iPods, iPod touches, or iPads have ever had their RAM listed.

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The Guvnor    56

Has anyone got an amount of ram in these yet? I can't understand why they haven't listed it in the "tech specs" on their own site, they list the amount of memory in every other device they sell.

We'll have to wait for a tear down for one of these.

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DavidM    329

Only for standard Intel platform computers. No iPhones, iPods, iPod touches, or iPads have ever had their RAM listed.

Right, and I understand why the phone and the pod don't have theirs listed but the ipad is a computer. Would you by a laptop without knowing how much ram is in it?

Anyway, I thought the the first ipad had it's ram listed, guess not.

We'll have to wait for a tear down for one of these.

I kinda figured the same thing after "nobody" talking about the magical and/or revolutionary amount of ram... he he. I hope it got a good bump, this is probably my last shot to buy one, the screen resolution is just about perfect, but the first gen was just too slow. I'm afraid the next one gets a screen resolution jump, it's why I had to pass on the Air - 11 @ 1366x768 and 13 @ 1440x900 it just too much for my aging eyes. :(

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Stetson    180

Right, and I understand why the phone and the pod don't have theirs listed but the ipad is a computer. Would you by a laptop without knowing how much ram is in it?

Anyway, I thought the the first ipad had it's ram listed, guess not.

I kinda figured the same thing after "nobody" talking about the magical and/or revolutionary amount of ram... he he. I hope it got a good bump, this is probably my last shot to buy one, the screen resolution is just about perfect, but the first gen was just too slow. I'm afraid the next one gets a screen resolution jump, it's why I had to pass on the Air - 11 @ 1366x768 and 13 @ 1440x900 it just too much for my aging eyes. :(

The screen resolution won't make things smaller like it does on a PC. Have you looked at an iPhone 4? All the text and images stay the same physical size, there's just more detail.

As far as the RAM goes, I don't know exactly why they don't list it, but part of it might be that they feel like they can get good performance out of less RAM than their competitors through OS optimizations. They might feel that a 512mb iPad is just as good as a 1GB Android tablet, but if they publish the number people will try to compare them directly. Still weird though.

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TheLegendOfMart    1,558

smallthumbnaili.jpg

I ******* LOVE CHARLIE BROOKER

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TheLegendOfMart    1,558

Spot the mac user !!!!!!!!!!!!! Charlie is a sarcastic cynic after my own heart but i think he has it spot on. CLAP CLAP CLAP CLAP CLAP CLAP WOOHOO for a $40 optional HDMI out cable, pretty ridiculous.

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Stetson    180

:) Yep, I think I'll pick up one of those soon for my iPod touch.

It only supports the mirroring on the iPad 2. It'll still let you put out 720p video though.

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