Handcuffed Girl, 20, In A Coma After being Tased. Police not Charged

[Arkaic]

This girl was a dumbass, drugged up, committed a crime, and resisted arrest. If she wasnt so damn stupid, she would be fine. She knows how the law works and is old enough to know better. And like someone else commented earlier, the same thing could of happened if she was tackled buy the officer. But hell, I guess the cop should of let the girl run away (possibly) instead of doing anything and then maybe her next hit/run will kill someone. I feel no sympathy for her.

I always find it funny that these police brutality videos never/hardly ever shows/states what happens before the incident.

dumb? :yes:

drugged up. :yes:

resisted arrest. :yes:

good for your no sympathy rule.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lv79tQi8Uo4

deserved a senetencing through court. :yes: !!!!

[techbeck]

Wow, pretty delusional. I bet you break the law in many ways you wont admit. No one is perfect, and to expect as much from a regular citizen is outlandish. You must be on a pretty tall pedistal.

Now you are just nit picking...you know what I mean. Yes, everyone brakes the law at one point and time...even cops. No one is exempt. But speeding is way different from what she did and is not even a comparison.

I obey the law MEANING I dont hit someone and flee, I dont do drugs, I dont hurt/injure anyone and if a cop tells me to do something (like stop when speeding) I do it.

[Arkaic]

Did you see the video? She hit her head pretty hard and started to get back up. Then said she couldnt get up and the cop said he didnt want her to. Which is what cops tell suspects to do normally. It was a couple minutes after she hit her head that she had issues.

If the woman didnt run, she would be fine and there would of been no need to be chased/tasered. Its the girls own fault.

M.E. report simple. oh btw, oxy does NOT kill pain right away. so things don't have to be instant.

Yes, because thats exactly what I said...if you are on drugs and run from the cops, you should be shot. And again, have a pity party all you want for her. It was her fault...maybe the parents should of raised her better.

And I have no worries about being shot or chased down by the police because I obey the law. And there is a difference between speeding and being arrested, charged with drugs and a hit/run.

No, it doesnt. Her running started everything and how do you know she would of been fine? She was on drugs and probably out of her mind. She could of very well ran infront of a car and kill herself as well as others.

When the Nazis came for the communists,

I remained silent;

I was not a communist.

When they locked up the social democrats,

I remained silent;

I was not a social democrat.

When they came for the trade unionists,

I did not speak out;

I was not a trade unionist.

When they came for the Jews,

I remained silent;

I wasn't a Jew.

When they came for me,

there was no one left to speak out.

'nuff said.

oh if you DON'T see the writing on the wall. you must be blind.

[techbeck]

M.E. report simple. oh btw, oxy does NOT kill pain right away. so things don't have to be instant.

WTF are you talking about? You post another video that has nothing to do with this topic, you stay some nonsense about OXY....she was on OXY before they arrested and coke. I said nothing about OXY killing her pain. I said she hit her head, tried to get up, cops told her to keep laying down, and then a few minutes later she was unconscious because of her hitting her head so hard.

And as far as I know and from reading hte OP...she isnt dead...shes in a coma.

[Arkaic]

WTF are you talking about? You post another video that has nothing to do with this topic, you stay some nonsense about OXY....she was on OXY before they arrested and coke. I said nothing about OXY killing her pain. I said she hit her head, tried to get up, cops told her to keep laying down, and then a few minutes later she was unconscious because of her hitting her head so hard.

Ok. maybe I will spell it out.

Oxycontin does not act instantly on it's intended use (pain) therefore; using extrapolation maybe the chemical reactions from the tasering were not instant either.

Cocaine. I'm not sure how it works but it is a stimulant, unlike Oxycontin. Also I'm saying neither of us are the M.E. (Medical Examiner) and therefore do not have her body to find out.

PS: You dodged my question. Are you in politics or law enforcemet in any capacity?

Edit: not dead just vegitative. okay got ya. everything allrite now.

[techbeck]

Ok. maybe I will spell it out.

Oxycontin does not act instantly on it's intended use (pain) therefore; using extrapolation maybe the chemical reactions from the tasering were not instant either.

Cocaine. I'm not sure how it works but it is a stimulant, unlike Oxycontin. Also I'm saying neither of us are the M.E. (Medical Examiner) and therefore do not have her body to find out.

PS: You dodged my question. Are you in politics or law enforcemet in any capacity?

Edit: not dead just vegitative. okay got ya. everything allrite now.

Read here as it provides more info than what the OP put. He coma was the cause of hitting her head.

http://crippledscience.com/?p=9197

http://alcoholism.ab...a/oxycontin.htm

Under prescribed dosage, OxyContin is an effective pain reliever, but when crushed and snorted or injected, the drug produces a quick and powerful "high" that some abusers compare to the feeling they get when doing heroin. The NIDA reports that in some areas of the country, OxyContin abuse rates are actually higher than heroin abuse.

http://www.webmd.com...and-its-effects

What's so great about being high on coke? Cocaine users often describe the euphoric feeling as:

• an increasing sense of energy and alertness
  
• an extremely elevated mood
  
• a feeling of supremacy
  

On the other hand, some people describe other feelings tagging along with the high:

• irritability
  
• paranoia
  
• restlessness
  
• anxiety
  

Signs of using cocaine include:

• dilated pupils
  
• high levels of energy and activity
  
• excited, exuberant speech
  

And I didnt dodge your question...your question was irrelevant. I am not claiming to be an expect or anything...giving my opinion and what I think like everyone else here.

And thats all I will say on the matter. I said what I had to say so now time to bug someone else in another thread. :)

[Rygrath]

Think the best part of this whole debate on what the effective use of force is, all those that say there were better methods, have yet to describe what better methods to use.

In the interview with Internal Investigations the cop thought about tackling the fleeing suspect. He out-weighed her by a substantial amount. Let's say he goes for the tackle, falls on her. Her head slams into the floor, bones may be broken, and she still might have ended up in a coma, or dead to internal injuries. Also the risk of injury to the officer himself. You would still claim there would be other means.

He uses his club stick and knocks out her knee caps, you complain police brutality.

He grabs a shoulder to spin her around, she in turn bites the officers hand or kicks, risking injury to herself or the officer. You would still claim brutality. "Oh, but he's stronger and should be able to handle a weak little girl" you'll probably say. Well, ANYONE can be dangerous and be a risk for injury when properly motivated. It's a unknown factor police have to consider every time. A feral cat is small and weak, yet can severely injure you if trying to handle without protection and you run the risk of infections.

She was faced away running from the officer, he could not use pepper spray.

He wraps his arms around her, she kicks, bites, etc, risks injury to the officer and herself. You don't want bites in the case she has a infectious disease.

He asks very politely to stop running, high on drugs, she ignores and runs into traffic, getting herself killed or causing another accident in where others are now injured or killed.

Gets a hold of her, and takes her down, she seems rather fragile, her head still slams on the ground, maybe other injuries as he puts restraining moves on her. She still ends up in a coma.

So, pray tell, in all of your wisdom and experience in stopping a fleeing suspect high on drugs. How would you stop him/her? Again, without risking injury to yourself or others? So many of you are quick to jump on the "there was a better way" bandwagon without actually saying what they would have done that would have eliminated ALL risk to both the suspect, officer and the public at large. For all the bad coverage tasers have received, they have also been used in a lot of situations where the other choices were not much better. And before them, it was at gunpoint.

Yes, it's a shame she will probably never recover from the injuries, however, this was the risk she was taking with her choices in life. She could have easily been killed in her two hit and run accidents or killed others. Her choices led to this outcome in the end.

[techbeck]

<snip>

Thank you....and I agree. :)

[Arkaic]

Read here as it provides more info than what the OP put. He coma was the cause of hitting her head.

http://crippledscience.com/?p=9197

http://alcoholism.ab...a/oxycontin.htm

http://www.webmd.com...and-its-effects

And I didnt dodge your question...your question was irrelevant. I am not claiming to be an expect or anything...giving my opinion and what I think like everyone else here.

And thats all I will say on the matter. I said what I had to say so now time to bug someone else in another thread. :)

Mature, run away from a disucussion (as heated as it is).

You decide it's irrelavent so you will not answer. I will not answer you. I guess you're a law enforcement official.

[techbeck]

Mature, run away from a disucussion (as heated as it is).

You decide it's irrelavent so you will not answer. I will not answer you. I guess you're a law enforcement official.

Nope, not running away from anything. I said what I had to say and am tired of repeating myself. And its obvious we wont agree or come to any type of mutual understanding...and that is fine.

Have a good evening. :)

[Arkaic]

Nope, not running away from anything. I said what I had to say and am tired of repeating myself. And its obvious we wont agree or come to any type of mutual understanding...and that is fine.

Have a good evening. :)

You are right leave it as a disagreement. you too have a good evening, and im sincere when i say this was and interesting yet challenging convo.

[Another Canuck]

Group hug!

[shakey]

Think the best part of this whole debate on what the effective use of force is, all those that say there were better methods, have yet to describe what better methods to use.

In the interview with Internal Investigations the cop thought about tackling the fleeing suspect. He out-weighed her by a substantial amount. Let's say he goes for the tackle, falls on her. Her head slams into the floor, bones may be broken, and she still might have ended up in a coma, or dead to internal injuries. Also the risk of injury to the officer himself. You would still claim there would be other means.

He uses his club stick and knocks out her knee caps, you complain police brutality.

He grabs a shoulder to spin her around, she in turn bites the officers hand or kicks, risking injury to herself or the officer. You would still claim brutality. "Oh, but he's stronger and should be able to handle a weak little girl" you'll probably say. Well, ANYONE can be dangerous and be a risk for injury when properly motivated. It's a unknown factor police have to consider every time. A feral cat is small and weak, yet can severely injure you if trying to handle without protection and you run the risk of infections.

She was faced away running from the officer, he could not use pepper spray.

He wraps his arms around her, she kicks, bites, etc, risks injury to the officer and herself. You don't want bites in the case she has a infectious disease.

He asks very politely to stop running, high on drugs, she ignores and runs into traffic, getting herself killed or causing another accident in where others are now injured or killed.

Gets a hold of her, and takes her down, she seems rather fragile, her head still slams on the ground, maybe other injuries as he puts restraining moves on her. She still ends up in a coma.

So, pray tell, in all of your wisdom and experience in stopping a fleeing suspect high on drugs. How would you stop him/her? Again, without risking injury to yourself or others? So many of you are quick to jump on the "there was a better way" bandwagon without actually saying what they would have done that would have eliminated ALL risk to both the suspect, officer and the public at large. For all the bad coverage tasers have received, they have also been used in a lot of situations where the other choices were not much better. And before them, it was at gunpoint.

Yes, it's a shame she will probably never recover from the injuries, however, this was the risk she was taking with her choices in life. She could have easily been killed in her two hit and run accidents or killed others. Her choices led to this outcome in the end.

You seem to forget, cops are supposed to put themselves on the lines for citizens. It is part of the "protect and serve" claus. You don't become a cop to not put your life on the line for a citizen. You are their protectors, you must protect them from threats, even if it includes from their own self. You should not be risking their life in your actions. Or have the views of worth of a human's life changed to some having more importance?

It is a girl running, with her hands tied behind her back. Not much of a man if you can't catch that. Especially if you are a cop, who should be through some sort of physical training to keep in shape... But of course, now with tasers, they don't have to... they do this instead.

Think if fire fighters never tried to save others lives, because it was in danger of their own... They wouldn't be looked at as greatly as they are... If Police showed that much interest in actually saving as Firefights did.. It would be a whole much better place.

[DocM]

It's equally dangerous. not less. :yes:

No.

Studies show that the injury rate of tasers is about 0.3%, meaning that 97.7% of the time a person hit by one has no physiological effect a few minutes later. The 0.3% mostly are folks on cocaine, meth etc. or with a congenital heart defect that causes s cardiac arrythmia. Any of these could suffer an arrythmia from any exciting event; exrcise, a fight/flight etc. and there is no way to predict it. Still, most all survive.

OTOH most cops carry a .40 S&W pistol, which doesn't just punch a hole like many smaller calibers. These can produce hydrostatic shock - an injury far beyond the wound channel due to a 1,700 +/- shock wave that besides blasting tissues within several inches from the wound also propagates up the body through the large blood vessels. This can cause brain damage even from a low torso or high thigh wound. The damage can range from a hard concussion to a traumatic brain injuty (TBI) or even a brain hemorrhage (stroke) from overpressure in the small vessels. This results in a very high lethality rate.

There is NO WAY you can equate the two.

[Rygrath]

You seem to forget, cops are supposed to put themselves on the lines for citizens. It is part of the "protect and serve" claus. You don't become a cop to not put your life on the line for a citizen. You are their protectors, you must protect them from threats, even if it includes from their own self. You should not be risking their life in your actions. Or have the views of worth of a human's life changed to some having more importance?

It is a girl running, with her hands tied behind her back. Not much of a man if you can't catch that. Especially if you are a cop, who should be through some sort of physical training to keep in shape... But of course, now with tasers, they don't have to... they do this instead.

Think if fire fighters never tried to save others lives, because it was in danger of their own... They wouldn't be looked at as greatly as they are... If Police showed that much interest in actually saving as Firefights did.. It would be a whole much better place.

This is more perfect world line of thinking that condemns people for doing their job. Once again, nothing to say what else he should have done. He could have tackled her, who's to say this wouldn't have resulted in the same outcome? There is a good dose of spur of the moment thinking where you don't have much time to react, you go with what you are trained to resolve the situation quickly. As been stated tasers have been mostly considered safe as a non-lethal method of controlling a person.

The taser was not the result of her coma, her head hitting the concrete falling did. Which could have happened had he just tripped her feet, pushed her, tackled her etc. Again, it was HER choices in life that led to this. The outcome isn't the most pleasant, but neither is most of the world out there. The cop that used the taser did not do so with the intent of causing her a coma or death. He wanted to get a trouble maker under control that became a fleeing felon. He believed the use of the taser was a safer method that tackling the girl. If you read the interview, he stated he considered it, but was concerned his weight could cause her serious injury.

You people have to stop being so quick to damn things before considering other view points. Until they make a completely safe Star Trek type stun weapon, the officers out there have to use the tools they are given. The taser was a step in the right direction.

[Doli]

She DIDN'T get up!

She got up from laying on the ground to sitting on the ground before going back down what looks like on her stomach.

It was silly to run out of a police substation because If she did get away they would have just got her at her home or parents home if she lives with them. Drugs are bad.

[Biotoxic_hazard_835]

FYI: PRESSTV is the propaganda arm of the Iranian Revolutionary Guard, so expecting anything close to balanced US coverage from them might be a tad unreasonable.

Context is everything and the OP has none. Someone's pre-conceived notions are showing.

This woman was originally arrested for two hit-and-run auto accidents and driving without a license - very serious stuff. She had slipped out of her cuffs (skinny) in the prowl car, they were re-applied, then she was taken into the station. Before she could be taken to the secure area she made a run for it (charge #4 - felony escape) and was tasered in the lot.

Sorry, but with an escaping prisoner who is younger & faster than the cop for whatever reason he has both the right and responsibility to apprehend her under the Fleeing Felon Rule. The taser is an appropriate option at so close a range since the injury rate from them is only 0.3%, far lower that a firearm or other more aggressive means including tackling.

Now - did the taser injure her? Not really. The cause of her coma was falling and striking her head on concrete (the lot), which could have happened anyhow because of her being cuffed while attempting to run during her escape attempt (off balance.) She could have just as easily hit her head being tackled, but either way this was HER FAULT!!

http://www.baynews9....-handcuffs.html

This.

[Athlonite]

Shoulda just shot the dumb bitch and saved the the tax payers some money, it's obvious she's a waste of space :angry: that had no intentions of reforming into an productive member of society

[Southern Patriot]

We must be watching different videos. I see a cop wearing a freaking vest - which makes it appear they have 50-60 extra body pounds.

Yeah, I made this same comment earlier. I think many people's (at least on here) only time seeing an American police officer is on TV.

[shakey]

Ya, cops never abuse or harass people who don't deserve it...

[techbeck]

Ya, cops never abuse or harass people who don't deserve it...

Seriously? Really? That video shows some douche bag going around to police stations and he is doing the harassing. Most of that video was the officers asking the guy to tell them about the complaint first before they allowed him to fill out a form. He refusing, give the cops a hard time, and he is asked to leave. Nothing wrong with that. And the guy complaining or asking for a form was acting suspicious. At the end of the video, the officers ask for ID and the guy walks away. The officers say not to walk away and he continues to do so. Then the guy says dont hit me when the officers were not even going to do so.

I never said or implied that cops never did anything wrong. There are bad cops as there are bad military personnel. But there are more good cops than there are bad. And some people are just itching to cry foul as well.

<Snipped>

Edited March 1, 2012 by Anaron

[shakey]

Seriously? Really? That video shows some douche bag going around to police stations and he is doing the harassing. Most of that video was the officers asking the guy to tell them about the complaint first before they allowed him to fill out a form. He refusing, give the cops a hard time, and he is asked to leave. Nothing wrong with that. And the guy complaining or asking for a form was acting suspicious. At the end of the video, the officers ask for ID and the guy walks away. The officers say not to walk away and he continues to do so. Then the guy says dont hit me when the officers were not even going to do so.

I never said or implied that cops never did anything wrong. There are bad cops as there are bad military personnel. But there are more good cops than there are bad. And some people are just itching to cry foul as well.

Actually, if you are reporting an abuse, you aren't supposed to talk to anyone except your lawyer and the other party involved ( and you only talk to the other party if it gets serious and far enough down the process.) Most police places have the forms, or you can get them online, or have the department mail/fax them to you. You should get yourself educated on how that process works, because it would help you understand the issue with the video.

Also, there is no law that requires a person to carry identification. The cops are straight out trying to itimidate and harass the guy , in hopes that he won't keep asking for a form to file abuse. How is that hard for you to see? If someone wants to file a report, they should not be harassed or arrested.

And you say the guy on the video is harassing them? Really? When all he is doing is saying, " I want a form to file for harassment/abuse. I don't want to discuss it, just give me a form." And you call that harassment and acting suspicious? I can see where different views will not allow this discussion to have any real merit, when your views are so vastly different.

[techbeck]

Actually, if you are reporting an abuse, you aren't supposed to talk to anyone except your lawyer and the other party involved. You should get yourself educated on how that process works, because it would help you understand the issue with the video.

Also, there is no law that requires a person to carry identification. The cops are straight out trying to itimidate and harass the guy , in hopes that he won't keep asking for a form to file abuse. How is that hard for you to see? If someone wants to file a report, they should not be harassed or arrested.

And you say the guy on the video is harassing them? Really? When all he is doing is saying, " I want a form to file for harassment/abuse. I don't want to discuss it, just give me a form." And you call that harassment and acting suspicious? I can see where different views will not allow this discussion to have any real merit, when your views are so vastly different.

Again, the guy was harassing the cops and asking for it. He had no real complaint and was just asking for trouble. They asked him for his ID and if anyone who had a valid complaint and was not hiding anything would provide. He was acting suspicious. And yes, he was when he would not tell the cops what was going on, not complying and listening to what they were telling him, demanding they give him a form, not providing ID or telling them who he is, and refusing to tell anyone what the complaint was. I find that suspicious.

The guy was looking for trouble and he found it.

[shakey]

Again, the guy was harassing the cops and asking for it. He had no real complaint and was just asking for trouble. They asked him for his ID and if anyone who had a valid complaint and was not hiding anything would provide. He was acting suspicious. And yes, he was when he would not tell the cops what was going on, not complying and listening to what they were telling him, demanding they give him a form, not providing ID or telling them who he is, and refusing to tell anyone what the complaint was. I find that suspicious.

It's not harassing someone if you are asking for something they are supposed to give you... I can't even think of an analogy to use, because this is already a good one, yet you aren't getting it. Police are public servants. They are supposed to work for the citizens. When a citizen walks in asking for a form, they should be met with respect and politeness, along with having their want fulfilled, as long as it is a reasonable task, IE - getting a paper to file a report in which anyone is free to do so.

Cops have no right to ask someone for their ID if there is nothing illegal happening. Just because he walked into the station asking for a police misconduct report does not warrant them getting his ID in any way, shape, or form.

Again, learn the process. You aren't supposed to tell other cops about the situation. You are supposed to get the form, write the issue on that, and have lawyers and other parties delegate it. No other officer should have involvement in it, and no other office needs to know why. You should educate yourself on this process before trying to back something up that you only have an opinion on, not actual facts.

Here is an example of not having to give your ID, and this happened to me a few years ago.

I was at a hospital where my sister was in labor and about to give birth. I had realized I stepped in dog ****, so I decided to go downstairs and outside to wipe it off. While I hobbled through the lobby, a sheriff stops me.

He says, " Show me your ID. We have reports of someone causing trouble in this hospital, running around and being a disturbance."

I reply, " Do you know his name or what he looks like?"

The sheriff says, " He is wearing a grey sweatshirt and black pants, just like you."

I said, " Ok, and do you know his name?"

He said, " No."

I replied again, " Well, what good would showing you a ID do, if you don't know who you are looking for? I've been upstairs, sitting in the waiting room for the past hour, waiting for my sister to give birth to her baby. I just noticed I had stepped in dog crap, and I am now walking outside to get it wiped off. I don't think showing you a ID will do anything for you, but I hope you catch whom ever is causing a problem. Also, I don't believe it is a law for me to have to carry identification with me unless I am in a motorized vehicle or supposed to have it for a certain task. "

He didn't say anything but just give me this sort of stare.

I then walked outside and wiped the **** off my shoe, then went back up into the waiting room.

It's called knowing your rights and not giving in to the pressure an officer will try and put on someone. This was a really small hospital, and there was no one running around. It seemed like he just wanted to try and cause something, because of how I was dressed and looked.... baggy jeans and grey hoodie, and while I was 26 at the time, I looked no older than 17 because of my young face. I was able to see him just drive away shortly after, no one in his car or anything.

In conclusion, the police work for us. We are not supposed to give into their every demand or way. We are supposed to try and follow the law, and they are supposed to try and uphold it. No where does it say we have to bend to their will, their demands, or their intimidation when it is not valid or reasonable.

[Farstrider]

It wasn't directed at any one person here, only at those who continue to post nonsense statements that aren't backed up by facts (and in many cases are completely contrary to the facts). The mods most likely won't give it a second though, and if they do, I couldn't care less. It needed to be said.

You sound a little like Winston Churchill: Once during a session of parliament Churchill was talking and said 'Half of the house are fools!'. Every member objected to his statement and started shouting at him to apologize. The speaker then told him to apologize to which Churchill coolly replied 'I agree. Half of the house are not fools'.

<Snipped>

Edited March 1, 2012 by Anaron