win9 "Threshold" to be Called Windows 9, Ship in April 2015

[firey]

Well its subjective opinion, but the mass majority will agree that the Task Manager, Explorer and many other smaller changes are very accepted.

 

My other fact still remains, they've not removed anything from Windows which made it great.

So a majority of the people.. support removing the start menu from explorer?  Then why are there so many people refusing to buy windows 8?  A majority of users have NOT upgraded to 8. A majority of a minority is still a minority of the whole. I am not saying that some things like improved task manager, better file copy control, etc are not improvements.  But things like Aero being removed, start being removed, forced full screen apps, etc are NOT an improvement.

[DConnell Member]

Then make it 3 way.. but make it a choice to have.  I want a start MENU, Aero, no full screen unless I set the window properties to full screen, etc.  

 

Again, as long as the choice is there for either the Screen, or a Modern-style menu. If a text list becomes the only option again I'm sticking with 8.1

 

Rather than having the hybrid removed, I want it improved upon. I don't like feeling like I'm running programs in a virtual machine. I'd much rather have them integrated into the main OS interface, even if it's just making the sidebar program list more aware of what's running on the desktop. And if Microsoft or someone else came up with a wrapper that let desktop programs run in Modern, I'd almost never see the desktop. (Like Modern Mix, but in the opposite direction.)

 

Nothing's keeping me on the desktop except the greater range of available programs. And  I haven't found a good file manager for Modern yet. But until developers release more robust programs for Modern, I can't do without the desktop just yet.

[firey]

Again, as long as the choice is there for either the Screen, or a Modern-style menu. If a text list becomes the only option again I'm sticking with 8.1

 

Rather than having the hybrid removed, I want it improved upon. I don't like feeling like I'm running programs in a virtual machine. I'd much rather have them integrated into the main OS interface, even if it's just making the sidebar program list more aware of what's running on the desktop. And if Microsoft or someone else came up with a wrapper that let desktop programs run in Modern, I'd almost never see the desktop. (Like Modern Mix, but in the opposite direction.)

 

Nothing's keeping me on the desktop except the greater range of available programs. And  I haven't found a good file manager for Modern yet. But until developers release more robust programs for Modern, I can't do without the desktop just yet.

 

Definitely a different strokes for different folks scenario.  Makes it much harder to code for, but with the changes they made to 8.. it's definitely a screwed if you do, screwed if you don't.  

[Fourjays Veteran]

Then make it 3 way.. but make it a choice to have.  I want a start MENU, Aero, no full screen unless I set the window properties to full screen, etc.

Do you actually want the start menu or the start search box and pinned links?

Just curious as I'm really surprised anyone uses the menu itself anymore. Last time I used it was XP and even then I eventually installed a program that did what Vista/7/8 do now. The start menu was a clunky and inefficient way of launching software back then and it still is now, so I don't get why anyone would use that instead of pinning/searching.

[firey]

Do you actually want the start menu or the start search box and pinned links?

Just curious as I'm really surprised anyone uses the menu itself anymore. Last time I used it was XP and even then I eventually installed a program that did what Vista/7/8 do now. The start menu was a clunky and inefficient way of launching software back then and it still is now, so I don't get why anyone would use that instead of pinning/searching.

 

Start menu.  I don't always pin apps as I like the task bar clean.   But I also don't want to have a full screen app selector.  my windows 7 has some common apps pinned to the top of the start menu, I can launch them without even looking.  I actually still use the start menu to quickly open up apps, while still being able to focus on what's happening outside the menu.  I use the search for quick launching (ie calc, cmd, etc) but I do still use the menu itself.

[JonnyLH]

So a majority of the people.. support removing the start menu from explorer?  Then why are there so many people refusing to buy windows 8?  A majority of users have NOT upgraded to 8. A majority of a minority is still a minority of the whole. I am not saying that some things like improved task manager, better file copy control, etc are not improvements.  But things like Aero being removed, start being removed, forced full screen apps, etc are NOT an improvement.

From your very bleak description of Windows 8 you're describing that it's a massive flop which has literally no following. From looking at the stats on steam, where the majority will be more dedicated PC enthusiasts, there's a massive group who are using 8 and 8.1.

 

Regarding remove the start menu from the explorer, that's why I was saying I can understand your dislike towards that. Although, from a functional point of view, you can use it in the very same way that the start menu was used. The only functional and big difference there is that it's full screen. Although from a UI point of a view, that's non-effecting since if the start menu was open, it couldn't exist open if your main focus was outside of the menu. 

 

You don't have to use the apps, so the argument isn't valid there. I find them quite refreshing and a cool advancement to the eco-system but they need improving.

 

With Aero, there's many plugins existing which revert the old Aero transparency back. That's a minor preference issue.

 

I feel like you're set on disliking it, just because you do. Windows 8.1 is a very, very good OS.

[firey]

From your very bleak description of Windows 8 you're describing that it's a massive flop which has literally no following. From looking at the stats on steam, where the majority will be more dedicated PC enthusiasts, there's a massive group who are using 8 and 8.1.

 

Regarding remove the start menu from the explorer, that's why I was saying I can understand your dislike towards that. Although, from a functional point of view, you can use it in the very same way that the start menu was used. The only functional and big difference there is that it's full screen. Although from a UI point of a view, that's non-effecting since if the start menu was open, it couldn't exist open if your main focus was outside of the menu. 

 

You don't have to use the apps, so the argument isn't valid there. I find them quite refreshing and a cool advancement to the eco-system but they need improving.

 

With Aero, there's many plugins existing which revert the old Aero transparency back. That's a minor preference issue.

 

I feel like you're set on disliking it, just because you do. Windows 8.1 is a very, very good OS.

 

Honesly, I dislike it.. because I shouldn't have to pay for a third party app to do what first party should.  If apps like startisback, modernmix, winaero revivers, etc where free I wouldn't really have any complaints.  I dislike the direction they went.  It's the same with a phone provider.. if I have to pay extra for something that another version, plan, company, etc provides for free.. why would I support that?

[JonnyLH]

Honesly, I dislike it.. because I shouldn't have to pay for a third party app to do what first party should.  If apps like startisback, modernmix, winaero revivers, etc where free I wouldn't really have any complaints.  I dislike the direction they went.  It's the same with a phone provider.. if I have to pay extra for something that another version, plan, company, etc provides for free.. why would I support that?

That's fair enough. I personally feel like you're ditching a considerably improved OS from the desktop point of view for something quite trivial and functionality that can be achieved differently. Like people before me have said, pinning to start bar etc. For example, I run Windows 7 at work and I never use the start menu, at all.

 

It's your call though, obviously the start screen is a deal breaker for you.

[kaotic]

So a majority of the people.. support removing the start menu from explorer?  Then why are there so many people refusing to buy windows 8?  A majority of users have NOT upgraded to 8. A majority of a minority is still a minority of the whole. I am not saying that some things like improved task manager, better file copy control, etc are not improvements.  But things like Aero being removed, start being removed, forced full screen apps, etc are NOT an improvement.

 

What is so great about aero? I'm using windows 7 right now and honestly I don't get it. 

[firey]

What is so great about aero? I'm using windows 7 right now and honestly I don't get it. 

 

I like the transparency.  I am not an artist by any means.. but I like graphics.  I like a little extra "bling".  

[domboy]

I actually like the idea behind Windows 8, I just think they made a few really bad decisions, and it sounds like Windows 9 may fix it. An OS that can switch between different UIs is a great idea for devices that can switch between being a tablet, a netbook/laptop, or desktop. The problem with the WinRT API is that the apps are stuck in a full-screen mode. Allowing WinRT/Modern apps to run in windows on the desktop as well (and be able to switch modes while the program is running) would pretty much fix my biggest problem with the OS... most apps don't need to be full-screen, sure it works ok on a small device when touch is the sole method for interacting, but that is rarely the case for anything except my phone. Even my Surface RT I rarely use as a true "tablet", as for someone that can type with all 10 figures (is that still called touch-typing?) no on-screen keyboard can replace a real one (none that I've seen so far anyway). So what happens is I actually use the desktop more often than not, even on this 10" device, but also still use touch a lot (on the desktop) to compliment the other input methods. Basically what I'm saying is that such an OS needs to be flexible to how the user wants to interact with it. And it needs to be something the user can configure and change.

[DConnell Member]

What is so great about aero? I'm using windows 7 right now and honestly I don't get it. 

 

Many of the functional elements of Aero are actually still present in 8 - the program thumbnails still show up on mouseover, for instance. The only thing that really seems missing is the transparency, which while cool-looking is a bit superfluous IMO.

[xWhiplash]

Regarding the start menu, I agree with Firey.  MS needs to add the classic Start Menu back.  It will not cost them billions (Start8, classicshell, startisback did not cost billions), and it will not be a support nightmare.  Windows 8 is already a support nightmare.  "Are you in desktop or metro right now?".  Why would a start menu change that?  8.1 already boots directly to the desktop if you let it, so again, how does a stat menu cause support nightmare?

 

However, I cannot stand Aero (transparency specifically) now.  I do prefer the Windows 8 desktop UI changes to Windows 7.  

 

Also, how does different OSes cause a problem?  Phones, tablets, desktops, xbox, ... they are NOT running the same OS.  Windows RT is not Windows Pro.  Can't you only get Windows pro on laptops/desktops and high-end MS tablets?  The phone cannot run Windows Pro right?

 

What about Windows Enterprise?  That is a different OS too.  Just add a start menu there and everybody will be happy.  

 

There is no....NO reason for apps to be full screen (or full screen split) on a desktop with 2560x1440 resolution.  Is it just pointless.  I got a 27" monitor for a reason, not to run Music on a larger screen STILL at full screen.

[Dot Matrix]

Whiplash, what does it matter which side the user is on? You can reach any point in the OS with Search, or a few clicks.

[xWhiplash]

Whiplash, what does it matter which side the user is on? You can reach any point in the OS with Search, or a few clicks.

 

I have yet to meet a general user that knows that they can search.  Every time I go to the start screen and just start typing, they ask me how I did that.  Then they ask me how I could have known about it since there is no visual indication of a search functionality.

[DConnell Member]

I have yet to meet a general user that knows that they can search.  Every time I go to the start screen and just start typing, they ask me how I did that.  Then they ask me how I could have known about it since there is no visual indication of a search functionality.

 

As much as I like Windows 8, I really think Microsoft dropped the ball by not providing a "cheat sheet" for users, and recommending for the OEMs to include one. Just a pamphlet to show users the basics would have alleviated a good 70% of the average users' complaints I've seen.

[Fourjays Veteran]

Start menu.  I don't always pin apps as I like the task bar clean.   But I also don't want to have a full screen app selector.  my windows 7 has some common apps pinned to the top of the start menu, I can launch them without even looking.  I actually still use the start menu to quickly open up apps, while still being able to focus on what's happening outside the menu.  I use the search for quick launching (ie calc, cmd, etc) but I do still use the menu itself.

So you still go to All Programs > Company Name > Program Name > Whatever to launch something? Or you just use the pinned shortcuts that are above All Programs (what I meant by pinned links)?

As soon as I got to Vista/7 I never went to All Programs unless I was desperately trying to remember the precise name of something so I could search for it instead (still needs fixing).

[firey]

So you still go to All Programs > Company Name > Program Name > Whatever to launch something? Or you just use the pinned shortcuts that are above All Programs (what I meant by pinned links)?

As soon as I got to Vista/7 I never went to All Programs unless I was desperately trying to remember the precise name of something so I could search for it instead (still needs fixing).

Yes, I still go to all programs sometimes.  I don't pin everything.  I mean, I know what I install, and the company that makes it.  I also keep the start menu sorted alphabetically, so it's easy to find what I need.  I mean, more often than not I definitely use the search, but I can keep watching the video, or reading the book, or whatever it may be as I launch the app from the start menu.

[AJerman]

I found Windows 8.1 to be a massive improvement over Windows 8 in functional terms. Here's to hoping "Threshold" will do the same. Metro and the Windows Store has been a joke for a while. Let's either get it right or get rid of it. Oh, and absolutely 100% get rid of it on servers. It's absolutely ridiculous to me that this ###### is on Windows 2012 Datacenter.

[+Warwagon MVC]

Every customer that asks me for new computer buying advice starts by asking me ...

 

"Which Windows do you recommend I get? I've heard bad things about Windows 8. I've heard its hard to use"

 

I'm not making this up. This has been my experience from people contacting me on computer buying advice. I tell them that if they buy a computer in the store they will be getting Windows 8 / 8.1. If they did want to get Windows 7. Their best bet is to shop online.

 

I'm guessing Dot Matrix will say everyone he knows Loves Windows 8. This is not to say some people don't legitimately like Windows 8. But if the people who love Windows 8 are acquaintances of DM i'm also guessing there might be some coolaid drinking involved

[Fourjays Veteran]

All they need to do for Windows 9 is bring the desktop and start screen together. Windows 8.1 is a lot better than 8.0, but the two still feel so disconnected.

I'd also like to see some of Windows older features begin to be modernized, replaced or removed where they make sense. I know this is difficult due to legacy support, but be smart and try to find suitable solutions rather than just slapping yet another coat of paint on the same OS. Desktop computing needs to advance in the same way other electronic devices are so it keeps some relevance.

[BajiRav]

I have yet to meet a general user that knows that they can search.  Every time I go to the start screen and just start typing, they ask me how I did that.  Then they ask me how I could have known about it since there is no visual indication of a search functionality.

On that train of thought - I have yet to meet a "general user" that knows they can search in start menu. In Windows 7.

 

Windows 8/8.1 is not a problem here. User is.

[+Warwagon MVC]

On that train of thought - I have yet to meet a "general user" that knows they can search in start menu. In Windows 7.

 

Windows 8/8.1 is not a problem here. User is.

 

Windows 7 has a search box. While most users don't know they can search its not for a lack of not seeing a search box. In windows 8.1 there is no search box to see, they just have to know to start typing into thin air.

[zhangm Supervisor]

Windows 7 has a search box. While most users don't know they can search its not for a lack of not seeing a search box. In windows 8.1 there is no search box to see, they just have to know to start typing into thin air.

Win 8 search can also be invoked from the Charms menu in addition to the Win Q shortcut (which regressed substantially in functionality during the 8.0 to 8.1 transition IMHO).

[+Warwagon MVC]

Win 8 search can also be invoked from the Charms menu in addition to the Win Q shortcut (which regressed substantially in functionality during the 8.0 to 8.1 transition IMHO).

 

Correct there again they have to know about the charms bar, they have to know about windows key + Q  (or even just the windows key in general) and it's still not on the same page (Visually) when you click start as with windows 7 / vista. :)