Microsoft working on "total update" to File Explorer for Windows 10.

[neufuse Veteran]

6 minutes ago, LimeMaster said:

The legacy Control Panel will only get removed once all the functions get moved over to the Settings app. And we've get got a long way to go before that happens, especially since recent builds have been primarily focusing on adding features to Edge.  

if they are going to move all the functions, why did they remove the ability to do stuff like pick custom colors before removing the old background / appearance control panel items?... not everything is making its way over... we are losing a lot of functionality in the transition

[+Gary7 Subscriber²]

When I really need to find a file I use XYplorer and have been long before Windows 10.  MS will mess up many users machines by doing this.

[LimeMaster]

Just now, neufuse said:

if they are going to move all the functions, why did they remove the ability to do stuff like pick custom colors before removing the old background / appearance control panel items?... not everything is making its way over... we are losing a lot of functionality in the transition

My guess is that they removed it because of compatibility issues with the new theme. Remember the RTM had graphical errors in the theme if you re-enabled coloured titlebar support.  Though the November update fixed that issue.

[neufuse Veteran]

Just now, LimeMaster said:

My guess is that they removed it because of compatibility issues with the new theme. Remember the RTM had graphical errors in the theme if you re-enabled coloured titlebar support.  Though the November update fixed that issue.

I highly doubt an RGB value for a desktop background would mess up a theme... I think they just want to limit choice to their predefined values

[+devHead Subscriber²]

12 hours ago, RandPC said:

That half a second is still pretty questionable when the old Win32 calculator loaded instantly... and really, it's a calculator. This is not a particularly complex or deep application. Why on earth do modern processors need time to load a calculator app?
My phone can load a calculator instantly. I'm 100% certain my desktop processor should be more then capable of doing the same, since this processor is still extremely close to the bleeding edge and heavily overclocked at that.

Momentary pauses to load every Modern app no matter how simple they are is absurd when the vast majority of them are extremely simple small applications, and their Win32 equivalents have been loading instantly on anything made in the last 15yrs or so. It all adds up to a lot of wasted time.
I find it extremely hard to believe Microsoft's developers cannot build a mere calculator that can load immediately. These small loads are there in pretty much all Modern apps, and there is very seldom any reason for it. Either it's deliberate which is stupid although I suspect is most likely what is happening, or the UWP framework has such a massive overhead on load that it renders an i7 6770 @ 4.8Ghz slower to load a calculator app then the tiny Atom core in my phone, or Microsoft's developers are just that incapable of building a performant app. None of these answers are very appealing.

Microsoft is capable of much better. We shouldn't have to accept loads on such simple apps.

 

My calculator in Windows 10 loads immediately.

[neufuse Veteran]

4 minutes ago, devHead said:

My calculator in Windows 10 loads immediately.

definition of "loading" is key here, yes the app loads instantly, but we are using the term wrong, it's time to usability we are looking at... run calc in windows 7 it instantly pops up in a fraction of a second to type into... same thing in windows 10 the window pops up instantly, but you have a quick splash which increases the time to usability higher then the old calc... we need to compare this apples to apples

[LimeMaster]

2 minutes ago, neufuse said:

I highly doubt an RGB value for a desktop background would mess up a theme... I think they just want to limit choice to their predefined values

Maybe, who really knows.

 

Anyways, basically they won't remove the Control Panel until most of it is ported over. So no need to worry just yet if you really dislike the Settings app.

[Dot Matrix]

2 hours ago, neufuse said:

I think my Intel nvme drive can handle it  (a lot of the example code out there for Universal app splashes have minimum time shown timers, so no mater what they show for x amount of time) the complaining is about why should I need a splash on a program that takes under 5 seconds to launch? If they make explorer a universal type app we will see the darn splash every time you open a folder because it will probably launch a new instance of the program for the new window, and if it is a single window only interface, gawd help all the admins out there and real workers that push documents and files all over the place........

Why not? It helps keep everything the same. Calculator is a UWA after all.

[neufuse Veteran]

24 minutes ago, Dot Matrix said:

Why not? It helps keep everything the same. Calculator is a UWA after all.

do you seriously want to see a splash every time you open up a folder? there is absolutely no reason for it, maybe we should put a splash up every time the start menu opens too?

[ensiform]

Is it required of all UWP apps even ones written in C++?

[+Fahim S. MVC]

49 minutes ago, neufuse said:

definition of "loading" is key here, yes the app loads instantly, but we are using the term wrong, it's time to usability we are looking at... run calc in windows 7 it instantly pops up in a fraction of a second to type into... same thing in windows 10 the window pops up instantly, but you have a quick splash which increases the time to usability higher then the old calc... we need to compare this apples to apples

My calculator is in a ready for input state quicker than I can move my hand from the enter key to a number key to start doing some maths. Is that better for you?

[neufuse Veteran]

Just now, Fahim S. said:

My calculator is in a ready for input quicker than I can move my hand from the enter key to a number key to start doing some maths. Is that better for you?

how fast you can move is not a comparison metric between versions, the fact is it DOES take longer for the universal app to become usable then did the win32... you can't deny that because it does, even if half a second longer it's still longer due to a splash sequence

[+Fahim S. MVC]

1 minute ago, neufuse said:

how fast you can move is not a comparison metric between versions, the fact is it DOES take longer for the universal app to become usable then did the win32... you can't deny that because it does, even if half a second longer it's still longer due to a splash sequence

It's the only valid comparison metric.  Is the application ready to use, or am I waiting for it?  In my case, it is ready to use.  Therefore, the 'splash screen' is completely irrelevant.

 

I don't need things to get faster on every release, I need them to be fast enough.  It's easy to find stuff to moan about if I am looking for a reason to moan ;-)

[neufuse Veteran]

3 minutes ago, Fahim S. said:

It's the only valid comparison metric.  Is the application ready to use, or am I waiting for it?  In my case, it is ready to use.  Therefore, the 'splash screen' is completely irrelevant.

 

I don't need things to get faster on every release, I need them to be fast enough.  It's easy to find stuff to moan about if I am looking for a reason to moan ;-)

I honesty don't get how clock ticks isn't a valid metric, it should be the only true way to compare two products, your metric is a perception not something that is truly measurable

[spaceelf]

Wasn't even close to a quarter of a second here on my SSD.  My experience is the same as his.

 

It is not measurable by any metrics I have available.

[MorganX]

21 hours ago, jjkusaf said:

Great...possibly more dumbing down to appease "touch" users.  /sigh

Hopefully whatever they do scales well.

[Jim K Global Moderator]

50 minutes ago, randomevent said:

Wasn't even close to a quarter of a second here on my SSD.  My experience is the same as his.

 

It is not measurable by any metrics I have available.

Measureable enough to capture it on a screenshot.   I haven't been able to capture the w32 calculators splash screen on a snapshot.  Ohhh...right...it doesn't have one.

[spaceelf]

24 minutes ago, jjkusaf said:

Measureable enough to capture it on a screenshot.

Not on my box.

[Ian W]

The powerful Ribbon UI will probably be tossed to conform with the design of most other UAP applications (e.g., use of hamburger button / menu). What a pity.

[BajiRav]

3 hours ago, neufuse said:

definition of "loading" is key here, yes the app loads instantly, but we are using the term wrong, it's time to usability we are looking at... run calc in windows 7 it instantly pops up in a fraction of a second to type into... same thing in windows 10 the window pops up instantly, but you have a quick splash which increases the time to usability higher then the old calc... we need to compare this apples to apples

I know that the Win7 calc didn't show splash but on this same system, I don't think the app version is bad in any way. This is my work laptop and doesn't have SSD or Hybrid HDD.

The app is ready by the time I get to it and that's all I care about.

 

 

Edit: The animations look slower in this GIF  even the closing animation is not this pronounced.

[Dot Matrix]

3 hours ago, neufuse said:

do you seriously want to see a splash every time you open up a folder? there is absolutely no reason for it, maybe we should put a splash up every time the start menu opens too?

I see splash screens for all for .5 seconds on my system. It doesn't bother me much.

[neufuse Veteran]

19 minutes ago, Dot Matrix said:

I see splash screens for all for .5 seconds on my system. It doesn't bother me much.

but working with folders you'd be fine with this? you have to think of it like this, you will be opening more then one folder to work with at a time in some cases... when you work with files all day you will have this constant flash of a folder icon splash screen for each folder you open because they each launch in their own process (potentially) as apposed to a calculator that you might open once and work with...

[chrisj1968]

Well, will this make Windows 10 go from a decent/loved OS, to a despised one?

 

in the early stages of development, I always said, MS should design the installer to interrogate the system its being installed on and install the OS based upon those features (touchscreen- more touchscreen oriented, non touchscreen, regular desktop.

 

But this will be a defining point surely for MS. Russian Roulette...

[Dot Matrix]

19 minutes ago, neufuse said:

but working with folders you'd be fine with this? you have to think of it like this, you will be opening more then one folder to work with at a time in some cases... when you work with files all day you will have this constant flash of a folder icon splash screen for each folder you open because they each launch in their own process (potentially) as apposed to a calculator that you might open once and work with...

Why would Explorer launch folders in a different window? Microsoft hasn't had that option on by default in years.

[shockz]

42 minutes ago, Dot Matrix said:

I see splash screens for all for .5 seconds on my system. It doesn't bother me much.

I don't see them for longer than that either on my home system, but others do have a pronounced wait time. I've seen the splash screens for as long as 1-2 seconds when first logging in. That would suck for things such as file explorer. I'm not sure why you're insistent on taking something that is currently instant to something that has a wait time, regardless of whether it's .5 seconds or 2 seconds. The point is, File Explorer is instant. UWX isn't.