Retailers see format war dragging on

[Boz]

Nothing more to slash off :/

I wouldn't be so sure.. I wouldn't be surprised if I saw $99 or even $79 players now. Toshiba is massive, don't underestimate their determination. They might've been slow, but if we are to judge by recent Microsoft's responses and Uni and Para still sticking with it, you can see some heavy heavy fighting in the upcoming months.

The fact is, time is TICKING. they have until June 2008 to saturate the market while they still have Warner. There's no waiting or delaying anymore for them. And this can ONLY be good for all of us.

If you'll read the Universal's statement carefully, they say they won't drop HD DVD and switch to Blu-Ray. They don't deny that they'll release on both formats, they just say they won't drop HD DVD. If they go back to being format neutral it's just as bad as dropping HD DVD.

There you go again, reading the meaning of perfectly clear statement to your own benefit. What part of they won't switch to Blu-Ray don't you understand?

[TruckWEB]

I love how you talk about a $99 player like its the entry price for HD-DVD. It isn't. The player that was featured at $99 isn't even a fully featured player.

Like StevoFC said, every HD-DVD player are full featured player. The Venturier or A2/A3 are 1080i player. The A30/A35 are 1080p player. Everything else is included, nothing missing. No crazy Profile to follow and understand.

But one thing I'll give you.... The $99 player was only for Black Friday or Boxing Day sale. IT IS NOT the entry price for HD-DVD. The cheapest is the Venturier at $199. It's not fair to say that HD-DVD player is ONLY $99 VS Blu-Ray (Sony PS3) at $399. Stop using that price point, it's simply not true. This was a special sale price.

[kak]

lots of text here

1) Are you kidding? It is what every promoter of HD-DVD says. I'm not twisting any words. To those who got the players at $99 (like myself), it was great. But it is ridiculous to keep talking about it like its still possible. It is not the entry level for HD-DVD.

2)The A2 and A3 are 1080i players. The alone is enough to consider them lacking in comparison to their counterparts. I never said the players were subsidized either, another poster did. I agree with Boz on the issue anyways (that Sony has subsidized their division far more than Toshiba has). Its pretty clear who is spending more money in this venture.

3)$1000 for a BD player? The MSRP is high, but they won't come that high. With the upcoming release of the Funai(?)/Sylvania player @ $300 and expected to hit even lower with Profile 1.1, it would be foolish for anyone to release a $1000 unit [Denon is, but we all know its foolish. Its by name only]. BD's entry point is indeed higher, I won't argue that, but its not nearly the gap that people are making it out to be.

[Boz]

They will have to start giving out free HDDVD players and free HDDVD movies for them to stay in play.

And this is bad how exactly? Bunch of people getting an incredible upscaling player with HD capability.. plus movies..

LOL.. yep the only good HD format is the one that costs $500 and up ha ha...

[MGS4-SS]

And this is bad how exactly? Bunch of people getting an incredible upscaling player with HD capability.. plus movies..

LOL.. yep the only good HD format is the one that costs $500 and up ha ha...

The only thing bad with my idea is that it will never happen.

[TruckWEB]

2)The A2 and A3 are 1080i players. The alone is enough to consider them lacking in comparison to their counterparts. I never said the players were subsidized either, another poster did. I agree with Boz on the issue anyways (that Sony has subsidized their division far more than Toshiba has). Its pretty clear who is spending more money in this venture.

Okay, you NEVER used a 1080i player with a good 1080p HDTV. Your statement is simply not true. Their is NO difference between 1080i and 1080p on a good 1080p HDTV.

I had both, so I know. That nice 1080p thing is a very very powerfull marketing plow to make people beleive that their current TV is outdated.

[+Mirumir Subscriber¹]

imo, both camps failed because they should have started with PC adoption first. They should have gotten out PC-based Blu-ray/HD-DVD readers first followed by burners. Instead, the first PC drives costed more than PS3 or stand-alone Blu-ray/HD-DVD players and supply was limited.

[Emn1ty]

3)$1000 for a BD player? The MSRP is high, but they won't come that high. With the upcoming release of the Funai(?)/Sylvania player @ $300 and expected to hit even lower with Profile 1.1, it would be foolish for anyone to release a $1000 unit [Denon is, but we all know its foolish. Its by name only]. BD's entry point is indeed higher, I won't argue that, but its not nearly the gap that people are making it out to be.

You have a nack for not reading every word. I said "depending on quality", which means the player could have a number of factors such as multi-disc, RW, recording, assortments of input/output jacks, multiformat, etc. My price ranges were from the cheapest possible to the most expensive possible. And even if the diference between the average entry prices aren't that huge, the fact of the matter is that Blu-ray will stay the same for a LONG time so Sony can make a profit, where HD-DVD will drop much quicker since they are already making some profit (repeating myself again since you don't read everything or just disregard it to keep your side strong).

[Coldgunner]

gotta let this hddvd v BD thread pass, becoming childish nitpicking again

[Emn1ty]

gotta let this hddvd v BD thread pass, becoming childish nitpicking again

Might as well keep it going in this topic rather than let 50 more topics start about it later.

[Sethos]

gotta let this hddvd v BD thread pass, becoming childish nitpicking again

Yeah, huge crackdown on the Gamers Hangout due to the same crap - But every HD DVD & Blu-ray threads are taking the same direction, they are even worse, yet they get away with it.

Nothing happens here ... we got like 5-6 threads a week with a bunch of zealots going at each other :laugh:

[Coldgunner]

this whole $500 price point for a bd player is completely imbalanced.

the PS3 ain't just a BD player, people are buying it for its gaming abilities too, as in a lot of cases it replaces the PS2 under the TV.

standalones haven really come down in price I feel because its because the majority are going for PS3.

or in UK prices its ?170< for hddvd or PS3 for ?300. I know which one I went for...

edit: I realise this contradicts what I said above, but I wanted one thing clear.

Edited January 10, 2008 by Coldgunner

[Hupp]

why can't they just come out with nothing but dual format players and let the studios decide what they want to put the movie on. that would be my perfect scenario

[Emn1ty]

why can't they just come out with nothing but dual format players and let the studios decide what they want to put the movie on. that would be my perfect scenario

Because its cheaper to pay for one and not both...

[sn00pie]

i don't see Paramount and Dreamworks jumping ship until there "deal" with HD DVD is up, after that its a no brainer.

[Ayepecks]

Nothing more to slash off :/

What on earth are you talking about? If you start selling HD DVD players for prices that rival DVD players (anywhere in the range from $50-$100, maybe $150 max) you're going to create a massive market, and people won't be worried about HD DVD going dead because they'll still have a DVD player and didn't spend much.

They will have to start giving out free HDDVD players and free HDDVD movies for them to stay in play.

That's just an incredibly stupid statement.

[TDQuiksilver]

That's just an incredibly stupid statement.

Careful now. I wouldn't be so haste to say that. After all, these "lower" prices on movies and hardware obviously didn't help HD-DVD to the extent they thought. All the hype over "cheap players!" and Blu-ray still continues to outsell. Would it really be that stupid to think that HD-DVD suppliers may have to rely on even more desperate moves to keep above water?

[Julius Caro]

To this point, every "we remain committed" is unreliable, lol.

Wasn't FOX going to switch? If FOX had been in your side (boz), supporting and praising HD-DVD as they do with Blu-ray, you would have also said that there's no way in hell they are going to make the switch.

Yet they were (supposed) to go red!

So don't say that there's no chance Uni or Paramount are going blu like it was the ultimate truth. Based on what's happened, any "we are committed to ___" should come with a fine print "but that doesn't mean we aren't going to support the other format in 3 weeks".

Of course, that shouldn't be a reason to think that either of those studios is going blu or neutral. But don't go all "Ultimate truth" because we all know how it turned out with warner. Not only that, but right now the most logical thing is that they have considered going blu. Even if they don't end up doing it, they surely have. If paramount escape clause is true, then they TOTALLY considered beforehand going blu again if the scenario changed.

Rumors like this risk going on day after day, week after week. We'll see.

Just one more thing. If blu-ray at $300-400 are outselling HD-DVD, that means there's more demand for blu-ray. Demand considered as "price-quantity" ratio rather than just "quantity". Up to this point, I always believed that there was more demand for HD-DVD players, but that the PS3 accounted for the higher software sales on blu-ray. But if Blu-ray players are actually outselling or selling in the same numbers as HD-DVD, that's definitely not good for HD-DVD.

[Ayepecks]

Careful now. I wouldn't be so haste to say that. After all, these "lower" prices on movies and hardware obviously didn't help HD-DVD to the extent they thought. All the hype over "cheap players!" and Blu-ray still continues to outsell. Would it really be that stupid to think that HD-DVD suppliers may have to rely on even more desperate moves to keep above water?

No crap Sherlock, it's a massive advantage to have your technology built in one of the three major consoles -- no one would argue that.

And back up your statements. All the hype about "cheap players!" helped HD DVD outsell Blu-Ray in terms of standalone units and not gaming consoles. And, yes, it is stupid to even remotely consider them GIVING AWAY players and movies.

Please note that I've already said HD DVD is as good as dead and it will take a miracle to revive them, I'm merely commenting on if they even want to attempt to stay in the race.

[Tech Star]

Let's just wait until after their contracts are up. :) After that we will know if they will jump ship. :)

[notuptome2004]

ya know i would like to ask the head guy who brain idea it was to switch to blu-ray why and this would be the Question.

Ok so the Reason you switched to Blu-ray is because it is getting online features and Picture and Picture features and other features in witch HD-DVD already has so that is why you are switching.

or

So is it true you switched to blu-ray because it is finally getting features you already have over in the HD-DVD camp

HD-DVd all the way for me

[TDQuiksilver]

No crap Sherlock, it's a massive advantage to have your technology built in one of the three major consoles -- no one would argue that.

And back up your statements. All the hype about "cheap players!" helped HD DVD outsell Blu-Ray in terms of standalone units and not gaming consoles. And, yes, it is stupid to even remotely consider them GIVING AWAY players and movies.

Please note that I've already said HD DVD is as good as dead and it will take a miracle to revive them, I'm merely commenting on if they even want to attempt to stay in the race.

Of course it's an advantage and was a very risky, yet now, smart move. You've got to give them credit. But with standalone Blu-ray player prices dropping... it's almost becoming just as reasonable as a two-in-one unit such as the Playstation 3.

Your inability to hold a civil conversation firstly lies in the fact that you were not able to clearly see the initial joke in "giving away free players." He was taking a stab at HD-DVD's inability to sway consumers and the continued desperation moves they would have to make. ;)

[Ayepecks]

Of course it's an advantage and was a very risky, yet now, smart move. You've got to give them credit. But with standalone Blu-ray player prices dropping... it's almost becoming just as reasonable as a two-in-one unit such as the Playstation 3.

Your inability to hold a civil conversation firstly lies in the fact that you were not able to clearly see the initial joke in "giving away free players." He was taking a stab at HD-DVD's inability to sway consumers and the continued desperation moves they would have to make. ;)

I've never said Sony doesn't deserve credit for putting it in their system. I've always contested that it would be good for the system from a technological standpoint even if Blu-Ray failed as a movie alternative as they could have more space, but it hurt them from a gaming perspective as it drove up costs.

I'm well aware of what he was doing. It was still an incredibly stupid statement no matter how you cut it. Read my post before his and you'll understand why he made his statement. He's been continually trolling all the Blu-Ray/HD DVD threads and making similar comments -- search his posts.

[AlphaPrime]

"Paramount's current plan is to continue to support the HD DVD format"

"Universal's current plan is to continue to support the HD DVD format"

Whatever their future plan is, just don't be surprised if it goes either way.

[Carlos11]

Here are the official supporters list.

Blu-Ray

HD DVD

Blu-ray supporters list is very impressive.

Anyway, here in Brazil those HD players are too expensive and I may say rare (most of them cost 2 times the USA price) so we'll probably start to use the winner format after all.