Boz Posted January 12, 2012 Share Posted January 12, 2012 Thats the reason it is so badly optimized. Badly optimized.. LOL.. seriously.. you guys are getting really old with that crap. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nitins60 Posted January 12, 2012 Share Posted January 12, 2012 Badly optimized.. LOL.. seriously.. you guys are getting really old with that crap. Thanks for troll... I knw what crap android is about. Buy a phone now, hold it for 6 months... Sorry, you got phone from age old, need new phone for upgrades. wtf!!!! Muhammad Farrukh 1 Share Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Boz Posted January 12, 2012 Share Posted January 12, 2012 Thanks for troll... I knw what crap android is about. Buy a phone now, hold it for 6 months... Sorry, you got phone from age old, need new phone for upgrades. wtf!!!! Look who's calling out who on trolling. First of all you don't have to buy a new phone. People buy them because in 6 months the technology is rapidly improving and competition is making faster and better phones. It was the same way with PCs. There is nothing wrong with that. Only a retarded company has you holding the same phone for 2 years without being able to upgrade to anything else. But I guess you are used to it since your whole ownership of a device is not really yours and you are being told what you should and shouldn't get. What a great pro-consumer thing that is. NOT! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dot Matrix Posted January 12, 2012 Share Posted January 12, 2012 Badly optimized.. LOL.. seriously.. you guys are getting really old with that crap. We're not the only one's saying this. Take a read at what this guy had to say: http://spillwaybrain...10/why-windows/ Pay closer attention to how he draws out Android. Do you think that's all Nokia is worth? Stephen Elop had two choices to make: Go with Android, and become "just another phone" and succum to the eventual decay of the company, or go with WP, and have a chance to shine above everyone else. Which would you have chosen? Stoffel and Muhammad Farrukh 2 Share Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Muhammad Farrukh Posted January 12, 2012 Share Posted January 12, 2012 Look who's calling out who on trolling. First of all you don't have to buy a new phone. People buy them because in 6 months the technology is rapidly improving and competition is making faster and better phones. It was the same way with PCs. There is nothing wrong with that. Only a retarded company has you holding the same phone for 2 years without being able to upgrade to anything else. But I guess you are used to it since your whole ownership of a device is not really yours and you are being told what you should and shouldn't get. What a great pro-consumer thing that is. NOT! You don't get it do you. OR You don't wanna get it. Read carefully here. Very carefully https://www.neowin.net/forum/topic/1047203-a-good-smartphone-comes-but-once-a-year/page__fromsearch__1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Boz Posted January 12, 2012 Share Posted January 12, 2012 We're not the only one's saying this. Take a read at what this guy had to say: http://spillwaybrain...10/why-windows/ Pay closer attention to how he draws out Android. Do you think that's all Nokia is worth? A run down OS that faces huge problems WP or iOS don't have? Who is we? You do understand that is' people who hate Android and own the competing platform are really the only ones who have issues with it. It's ridiculous. And yes, if this guy says, then it's totally true. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Stoffel Posted January 12, 2012 Share Posted January 12, 2012 Question to you! was my statement wrong? No it wasnt... at the same time the statement I replied to was also true... I was just pointing out the fact about both sided.... If anyone take that as argument its not my fault... I was trying to make a healthy conversation but now it seems like a debate... Again, I am not here to argue.... What the other poster was probably trying to say is, don't sound like an douche if you want to start a healthy conversation. Maybe you didn't mean it this way, but the way you wrote it made you sound pretty arrogant i guess Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dot Matrix Posted January 12, 2012 Share Posted January 12, 2012 You do understand that is' people who hate Android and own the competing platform are really the only ones who have issues with it. It's ridiculous. No, no it's really not. You can ask any Droid phone user, and they'll tell you the phones and OS have issues. I said back in a previous post, Android smartphones are a race to the bottom. It's no secret that many, many Android smartphones suffer from a wide range of hardware and software related issues. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Boz Posted January 12, 2012 Share Posted January 12, 2012 You don't get it do you. OR You don't wanna get it. Read carefully here. Very carefully http://www.neowin.ne...__fromsearch__1 Who doesn't get it.. that is bunch of nonsense. CHOICE is ALWAYS good. That's how computer industry exploded and innovated. Competition is great. Race to the bottom is great for consumer. Only an idiot would want to keep paying something top price. Only with Apple's anti-consumer model and the reality that they can't release a phone more then once every 18 months or whatever is taken as a good thing. Give me a break. You don't get it. Or you are too young to remember what rapid innovation and choice in technology allowed us. Either way it's pointless to argue with people who are biased towards Apple. I get it. That mentality that everyone else is wrong and Apple is always right will never go away. It's the part of the mentality of an average Apple consumer and why the company is making so much money. You are starved with choices until you HAVE to go and a buy a new device. Pretty great. Btw, Apple wouldn't be able to give you crap if it wasn't for other companies that build Android phones and make these technologies and hardware improvements and innovation in the first place that Apple buys. No, no it's really not. You can ask any Droid phone user, and they'll tell you the phones and OS have issues. I said back in a previous post, Android smartphones are a race to the bottom. It's no secret that many, many Android smartphones suffer from a wide range of hardware and software related issues. Yeah.. every phone is just not working .. but iPhone is great and flawless like antenna problems, screen problems etc etc.. and then you don't get another phone for another 2 years. ha ha.. And if you are not using Android phone as a primary phone you have zero credibility to even discuss this topic. You are basically just talking about something you want to be reality. Android phones might have an issue here and there but nothing more then what iPhone had and if you don't like that manufacturer's quality you go with someone who is better. That's the power of choice. You don't like your iphone or has issues, you are being told you are holding it wrong and you can kiss your money goodbye and wait for a revision you will buy again. Emon 1 Share Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Brandon H Supervisor Posted January 12, 2012 Supervisor Share Posted January 12, 2012 Who doesn't get it.. that is bunch of nonsense. CHOICE is ALWAYS good. That's how computer industry exploded and innovated. Competition is great. Only with Apple's anti-consumer model and the reality that they can't release a phone more then once every 18 months or whatever is taken as a good thing. Give me a break. You don't get it. Or you are too young to remember what rapid innovation and choice in technology allowed us. Either way it's pointless to argue with people who are biased towards Apple. I get it. That mentality that everyone else is wrong and Apple is always right will never go away. It's the part of the mentality of an average Apple consumer and why the company is making so much money. You are starved with choices until you HAVE to go and a buy a new device. Pretty great. Btw, Apple wouldn't be able to give you crap if it wasn't for other companies that build Android phones and make these technologies in the first place. Yeah.. every phone is just not working .. but iPhone is great and flawless like antenna problems, screen problems etc etc.. and then you don't get another phone for another 2 years. ha ha.. And if you are not using a phone as a primary phone you have zero credibility to even discuss this topic. You are basically just talking about something you want to be reality. Android phones might have an issue here and there but nothing more then what iPhone had. do you realize how big of a hypocrite you sound like? nitins60, Muhammad Farrukh and Duffydemon 3 Share Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Boz Posted January 12, 2012 Share Posted January 12, 2012 do you realize how big of a hypocrite you sound like? What's hypocritical about it? Do you even know what hypocritical means? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dot Matrix Posted January 12, 2012 Share Posted January 12, 2012 Yeah.. every phone is just not working .. but iPhone is great and flawless like antenna problems, screen problems etc etc.. and then you don't get another phone for another 2 years. ha ha.. And if you are not using a phone as a primary phone you have zero credibility to even discuss this topic. You are basically just talking about something you want to be reality. Android phones might have an issue here and there but nothing more then what iPhone had. I have an HTC Surround WIndows Phone, and love it. But, I constantly have to sit and watch my friends fumble around with their Droids. Most recently, one had a Samsung phone that got sent back almost 5 times before they gave up on it and bought an HTC Droid device. And just two weeks ago, I had a friend complain to me that Apple killed the Siri Android app. He was stunned to hear that it wasn't from Apple, and thought he had a virus. He then told me his next phone was going to be an iPhone. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Boz Posted January 12, 2012 Share Posted January 12, 2012 I have an HTC Surround WIndows Phone, and love it. But, I constantly have to sit and watch my friends fumble around with their Droids. Most recently, one had a Samsung phone that got sent back almost 5 times before they gave up on it and bought an HTC Droid device. And just two weeks ago, I had a friend complain to me that Apple killed the Siri Android app. He was stunned to hear that it wasn't from Apple, and thought he had a virus. He then told me his next phone was going to be an iPhone. So.. that means that Motorola phones didn't work good so they had an option to buy an HTC Android phone. What you just noted is CHOICE. Plain and simple. If you don't like a company's product you go with another company. Btw, those same phone manufacturers will be making Windows Phones.. so that must mean that Windows Phones sucks too right? With Apple for example, you only have 1 phone.. if that phone has issues, and Apple just refuses to acknowledge them as they usually do, you have no recourse. You can't go and get an HTC iOS phone, you can't go buy any other phone but wait 12-18 months to try to get another phone. How can you not understand this. Windows Phones are going to be great for consumer, not because of OS but because Microsoft has a same approach as Android. Trying to get as many choices to consumers as Android does. No difference. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Muhammad Farrukh Posted January 12, 2012 Share Posted January 12, 2012 do you realize how big of a hypocrite you sound like? :rofl: Who doesn't get it.. that is bunch of nonsense. CHOICE is ALWAYS good. That's how computer industry exploded and innovated. Competition is great. Race to the bottom is great for consumer. Only an idiot would want to keep paying something top price. Only with Apple's anti-consumer model and the reality that they can't release a phone more then once every 18 months or whatever is taken as a good thing. Give me a break. You don't get it. Or you are too young to remember what rapid innovation and choice in technology allowed us. Either way it's pointless to argue with people who are biased towards Apple. I get it. That mentality that everyone else is wrong and Apple is always right will never go away. It's the part of the mentality of an average Apple consumer and why the company is making so much money. You are starved with choices until you HAVE to go and a buy a new device. Pretty great. Btw, Apple wouldn't be able to give you crap if it wasn't for other companies that build Android phones and make these technologies and hardware improvements and innovation in the first place that Apple buys. Yeah.. every phone is just not working .. but iPhone is great and flawless like antenna problems, screen problems etc etc.. and then you don't get another phone for another 2 years. ha ha.. And if you are not using a phone as a primary phone you have zero credibility to even discuss this topic. You are basically just talking about something you want to be reality. Android phones might have an issue here and there but nothing more then what iPhone had and if you don't like that manufacturer's quality you go with someone who is better. That's the power of choice. You don't like your iphone or has issues, you are being told you are holding it wrong and you can kiss your money goodbye and wait for a revision you will buy again. nitins60 1 Share Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dot Matrix Posted January 12, 2012 Share Posted January 12, 2012 Btw, those same phone manufacturers will be making Windows Phones.. so that must mean that Windows Phones sucks too right? Not exactly. Go read that blog post I linked a few posts up, and you'll see what I mean. The author is dead on in his interpretations of the smartphone market. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Muhammad Farrukh Posted January 12, 2012 Share Posted January 12, 2012 I wonder if he actually did read those two articles. OR He just saw the pics in them and came back Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Brandon H Supervisor Posted January 12, 2012 Supervisor Share Posted January 12, 2012 What's hypocritical about it? Do you even know what hypocritical means? you are doing the exact same thing you acuse apple fan boys of doingin all reality Android is rather badly optimized, whether you want to believe it or not. yes things are getting a lot better with ICS but still, for the hardware that is in most android phones they are definitely not reaching their potential and nitns also has a point with this quote Thanks for troll... I knw what crap android is about. Buy a phone now, hold it for 6 months... Sorry, you got phone from age old, need new phone for upgrades. wtf!!!! the support for android phones is incredibly short, for a lot of phones you're lucky to get software updates after 6 months, considering most people are on 2 year plans before they can upgrade again, that's a rather large downfall and before you say anything, NO I'm not an apple fan boy, in fact I myself plan on getting an android phone sometime in the future when i get a job again How can you not understand this. Windows Phones are going to be great for consumer, not because of OS but because Microsoft has a same approach as Android. Trying to get as many choices to consumers as Android does. No difference. there is a difference, WP7 is being better optimized to work better with the different hardware it's on Muhammad Farrukh 1 Share Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Boz Posted January 12, 2012 Share Posted January 12, 2012 in all reality Android is rather badly optimized, whether you want to believe it or not. Okay.. I'm sick and tired of this.. let's talk about THAT BAD OPTIMIZATION.. I'm a developer and we can talk about technical aspects of it. Tell me.. what is badly optimized. We can go into it so we can really see what that is. Not some hear say and just repetitive garbage that doesn't really deal with the actual issues but just "oh it sucks it's badly optimized". Tell me.. what is badly optimized. We can talk about the Java Virtual machine, we can talk about memory allocation, we can talk about APIs, we can talk about graphics performance, we can talk about main and child threads or whatever. Tell me exactly what is it that lags and back it up with actual example instead of tiring rhetoric. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Muhammad Farrukh Posted January 12, 2012 Share Posted January 12, 2012 Android is badly optimized :p I'm glad Nokia made the right decision nitins60 1 Share Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Brandon H Supervisor Posted January 12, 2012 Supervisor Share Posted January 12, 2012 Okay.. I'm sick and tired of this.. let's talk about THAT BAD OPTIMIZATION.. I'm a developer and we can talk about technical aspects of it. Tell me.. what is badly optimized. We can go into it so we can really see what that is. Not some hear say and just repetitive garbage that doesn't really deal with the actual issues but just "oh it sucks it's badly optimized". Tell me.. what is badly optimized. We can talk about the Java Virtual machine, we can talk about memory allocation, we can talk about APIs, we can talk about graphics performance.. Tell me exactly what is it that lags and back it up with actual example instead of tiring rhetoric. don't get me wrong, it's not entirely googles faulta lot of it has to do with Android choosing to support such a LARGE range of hardware and all the call APIs needed for that to work (I think I have that right, I'm not a programer) but like I said, it has improved greatly with ICS edit: and I never said Android sucks, I like it and where they're going with it edit2: oh and when I say badly optimized I personally mean the responsiveness to touch, not in all cases but even you have to admit there are some times when it is noticeably laggy Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
still1 Posted January 12, 2012 Author Share Posted January 12, 2012 What the other poster was probably trying to say is, don't sound like an douche if you want to start a healthy conversation. Maybe you didn't mean it this way, but the way you wrote it made you sound pretty arrogant i guess I didnt mean it that way but people just poked me and i had to reply arrogant. but you know its been days so I am over it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Boz Posted January 12, 2012 Share Posted January 12, 2012 oh and when I say badly optimized I personally mean the responsiveness to touch, not in all cases but even you have to admit there are some times when it is noticeably laggy Absolutely true.. lag can occur sometimes.. but that's mostly because the developer of the app or poorly coded an app or a widget or whatever. You see, the best practice when making an Android applications is to keep the main thread as clear as possible and make sure that in your code you offload additional tasks to the child threads. This way your responsiveness will always be tops. The whole ecosystem and OS is fairly young. Developers have not gotten a chance to really understand and get into the best practices. A lot of the issues are also that people port some of the apps from other systems and sometimes the approach in code that runs great with on one platform and compiles great will not work great on another due to differences in languages and best practices as well as compilers. Btw, I have had a fair share of issues on iOS for example. on Iphone the same issue happens when I have bad apps. They have memory leaks and what happens is that it affects the whole OS layer even though on iOS the UI layer is rendered by GPU on a seperate thread. Memory leaks are the real problem and sometimes garbage collector in iOS (which is not really GC it's has like half-automatic thing) will not do a good job. That's why when you code in Objective-C for iPhone I have to always make sure that garbage collection is handled with care and manually double checked that my object memory address and pointers are killed to prevent memory leaks. Granted, Apple included Automatic Reference Counting in iOS5 that makes that task easier. But iOS5 is as young as ICS. Btw, while we are at it.. Android from version 1.0 has had GPU acceleration for the UI layer. The issue in earlier versions is that the actually content of views was rendered by software for greater compatibility because not all phones had same capabilities in rendering performance or GPU support. From Gingerbread, and especially Honeycomb (where we got support for multithreading/multicore execution and full hardware acceleration for everything) things have been pretty great and smooth even if your code has some memory leaks because Google created safe switches that will kill those processes immediately. ICS is just further optimization to that and graphics subsystem. Bad code will always happen. Memory leaks will always happen and when that happens it will take down performance and responsiveness of the OS no matter what it is. Major stumbling block in performance on some Android phones is not OS itself, it's the apps that companies might preinstall that might cause memory leaks and cause issues with the performance of the phone. For that, I will agree, they need to die. They need to provide us with an option to uninstall that garbage but you can solve that issue by using alternate launchers that are much better written and will make your phone perform much better. Ironically most of these guys writing launchers and additions to the Android are far better engineers and developers than the guys at HTC or Motorola or other Android makers writing those skins and launchers they ship phones with. It is important that a developers read documentation and advices from the OS maker and follow those guidelines in writing code. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Brandon H Supervisor Posted January 12, 2012 Supervisor Share Posted January 12, 2012 Major stumbling block in performance on some Android phones is not OS itself, it's the apps that companies might preinstall that might cause memory leaks and cause issues with the performance of the phone. For that, I will agree, they need to die. They need to provide us with an option to uninstall that garbage but you can solve that issue by using alternate launchers that are much better written and will make your phone perform much better. Ironically most of these guys writing launchers and additions to the Android are far better engineers and developers than the guys at HTC or Motorola or other Android makers writing those skins and launchers they ship phones with. i completely agree with your entire post, even from a standard user perspectivenow for the part I quoted and bolded. I agree HTC and Motorola with their extra layer UI are the worst, their extra UI's really slow down the OS uninstalling the UI/using a different launcher is easy enough, the problem is, a lot of lower end / less knowledgable users may not know about or how to do this, which leaves those users with a slow UI on their devices unless HTC or Motorola decide to improve and update it for the particular device (which they have actually done .... for a few) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Boz Posted January 12, 2012 Share Posted January 12, 2012 i completely agree with your entire post, even from a standard user perspective now for the part I quoted and bolded. I agree HTC and Motorola with their extra layer UI are the worst, their extra UI's really slow down the OS uninstalling the UI/using a different launcher is easy enough, the problem is, a lot of lower end / less knowledgable users may not know about or how to do this, which leaves those users with a slow UI on their devices unless HTC or Motorola decide to improve and update it for the particular device (which they have actually done .... for a few) Honestly, if I know that user is less savvy, I tell them to get Nexus S or now Galaxy Nexus. It's the pure clean Android experience and they will have zero problems and always get updates before everyone. As you said, the real problem is not Android as an OS or even as a platform, it's the companies. And I guarantee you that there will be a moment when one of these guys will just start releasing their phones stock (ASUS is one good example) and they will make a killing. I love ASUS for example because since they don't really have a lot of garbage in terms of UI changes they are able to update their devices weeks after official release of new Android versions. That's where other Android makers will hopefully be forced to go and just concentrate on hardware and let Android be android as it was meant to be. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Stoffel Posted January 12, 2012 Share Posted January 12, 2012 Who doesn't get it.. that is bunch of nonsense. CHOICE is ALWAYS good. That's how computer industry exploded and innovated. Competition is great. Race to the bottom is great for consumer. Only an idiot would want to keep paying something top price. Only with Apple's anti-consumer model and the reality that they can't release a phone more then once every 18 months or whatever is taken as a good thing. Give me a break. You don't get it. Or you are too young to remember what rapid innovation and choice in technology allowed us. Either way it's pointless to argue with people who are biased towards Apple. I get it. That mentality that everyone else is wrong and Apple is always right will never go away. It's the part of the mentality of an average Apple consumer and why the company is making so much money. You are starved with choices until you HAVE to go and a buy a new device. Pretty great. Btw, Apple wouldn't be able to give you crap if it wasn't for other companies that build Android phones and make these technologies and hardware improvements and innovation in the first place that Apple buys. Yeah.. every phone is just not working .. but iPhone is great and flawless like antenna problems, screen problems etc etc.. and then you don't get another phone for another 2 years. ha ha.. And if you are not using Android phone as a primary phone you have zero credibility to even discuss this topic. You are basically just talking about something you want to be reality. Android phones might have an issue here and there but nothing more then what iPhone had and if you don't like that manufacturer's quality you go with someone who is better. That's the power of choice. You don't like your iphone or has issues, you are being told you are holding it wrong and you can kiss your money goodbye and wait for a revision you will buy again. Why are you bringing Apple into this conversation again???? It's all about Android or WP7 on Nokia I didnt mean it that way but people just poked me and i had to reply arrogant. but you know its been days so I am over it. Hey fair enough. I just started reading the tread today. It just seems to happen more and more that people want to start a nice discussion but end up being really mean and arrogant in their writing. This is just my opinion. No harm Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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