Zizou Provoked by Serious Taunt?

[profets]

very interesting.. do you think what really caused him to snap was a remark about his mother? i guess it makes sense, as the person in the video asked about it being racial and replying by saying no, he's been used to that very often, or something like that

[Arielz]

Well let me redirect it to the FIFA officiating itself:

a) No one except the replay on the jumbotron showed the physical attack Zidane did

b) Neither the lines man, referee or the officiating squad saw it.

c) By FIFA rules, if the officials do not see it then it does not count.

This is NOT the NFL. So, Zidane regardless of his actions should not have been red-carded, at most due to the negligance of the officials been given a warning at the most. The entire FIFA has been a sack of BS. How did the SAME official give a free kick to France when the replays showed that the player faked the fall?! If they woudl not over rule that bs then this should also have bene let go. Apart from the players being disciplined the officals must be as well.

To expand on the BBC lip reader. Yes I know a bit about this part, he either said that profanity of f your mom in the a$$ either way, the nipple pinching and this verbal assault on a world class player shows just how disrespectful and arrogant the Italian player was. If France knew just how dirty the game was going to get I am sure they could teach Italy a few new career ending things.

I unfortunately voted for Italy but this abismal officiating has left a sour tone with me and requires a serious look at the use of TV to aid FIFA.

Just to add something about violence. When I played in teh mid field I would spend the extra time knowing the rough players either before the game or thru the game as we played. The vocals ones were not a threat unless the physical abuse came into play. It would aid me psychologically and also my body when I would be near such a player, either I would be prepared. I am sure people who play sports and are famaliar with what I am saying.

[BroChaos Veteran]

sticks and stones may break my bones, but words will never hurt me.

[Ambience]

sticks and stones may break my bones, but words will never hurt me.

Unfortunately, that phrase has been proven wrong in life too many times for it to hold much merit anymore.

[BroChaos Veteran]

not that i've ever seen. you guys are forgetting that we are talking about WORDS.

words vs. invading someones personal space. there is such a huge difference there it's not even funny.

[revvo]

not that i've ever seen. you guys are forgetting that we are talking about WORDS.

words vs. invading someones personal space. there is such a huge difference there it's not even funny.

Yeah, we're talking about WORDS.

How is racism mostly spread in this world? Through words and the end-result is always a lot of violence.

Just words, saying the n word, it's just a word right? Nothing compared to punches and hits :rolleyes: You see what damage that term can do?

If anything, verbal offense can be more damaging than physical offense. Physical wounds eventually heal but the mind is something more complex to overcome, and may stay affected for very long times, because of "WORDS".

Regardless of what exchange of words occured between Zidane and Materazzi, redcarded or not, Zidane remains the better player, the nicer player (overall less violent, more fair). Some people just gotta stop saying that he was stupid for doing so. In that case, half of the players are stupid. It's not the first time such a thing happens in football/soccer. It happens once in a while, heck on a regular basis except now its obviously a bigger deal because it was Zidane's last and most important match.

Edited July 12, 2006 by rainman.

[BroChaos Veteran]

a violent response to a racist remark is just as bad as the original remark. i'm not condoning racism at all, but i still believe words are just words. i guess it depends how strong of a person you are.

for example:

i call a black man the n word. he just brushes it off, because he knows i'm being foolish, and that there is nothing to be ashamed of.

or

i call a black man the n word. he physically attacks me, punches me, etc.

right or wrong, you can't justify violence in that situation. it does not fix anything. it only makes it worse.

the only time i could ever justify violence is if it is in self defence.

[L3thal Veteran]

a violent response to a racist remark is just as bad as the original remark. i'm not condoning racism at all, but i still believe words are just words. i guess it depends how strong of a person you are.

for example:

i call a black man the n word. he just brushes it off, because he knows i'm being foolish, and that there is nothing to be ashamed of.

or

i call a black man the n word. he physically attacks me, punches me, etc.

right or wrong, you can't justify violence in that situation. it does not fix anything. it only makes it worse.

the only time i could ever justify violence is if it is in self defence.

Well, every person reacts differently based on their personality. Zidane's parents come from Algeria, where terrorists roam around, and he grew up in a very tough neighborhood in France where he played soccer on concrete against other kids and when harsh fouls were committed, retaliation was common. Like Henry said, "you can take the man away from the neighborhood, but you cannot take the neighborhood out of the man."

Regardless, Materazzi is just a total scum both on and off the field. He is just a disgusting player and wouldn't be missed if he was kicked out of professional teams. I still cannot believe the videos of him injuring players like a mad man.

[Vykranth]

It was announced this morning that Zidane will give a TV interview 8 pm (French Time) to give his version of what happened

[L3thal Veteran]

It was announced this morning that Zidane will give a TV interview 8 pm (French Time) to give his version of what happened

We'll see what he says :yes:

[ekerazha]

:no:

Please double check your sources and facts before trying to make fun of others and ending up having yourself look like a buffoon.

My source is the FIFA official site: http://www.fifa.com/documents/static/organ...ary_code_EN.pdf

I couldn't know they made a revision on a separate page (a page that is not linked on the "circulars page").

This time I was wrong, however you was wrong most of the other times (-> https://www.neowin.net/forum/index.php?showtopic=462506 ).

Edited July 12, 2006 by ekerazha

[FlibbyFlobby]

I disagree.

First, why should we believe Materazzi? He just proved he's a liar today when he said he did insult him when two days ago he denied such claims. Why did he lie about it? Now, besides being a dirty scum of a player he is, he is a liar.

Second, how many times have you heard of players talking about their opponents mothers? These players are all professionals and they respect their opponents. The only time you see fights or head butts in football is when there is a very harsh tackle, not because your mother was insulted.

If you ask Zidane how many times a player insulted his mother, I can almost guarantee he will say once: Materazzi.

Zidane has headbutted someone before because they 'provoked' him. He's also been sent off for trampling on another player deliberatly too. Zidane may be a footballing genius, but hes far from a saint.

Edited July 12, 2006 by ziadoz

[ekerazha]

When Totti spitted to Poulsen nobody defended him because he was provoked :rolleyes:

[profets]

Ziadoz, ekerazha:

its nice to see a few people who have different view

zidane has been an incredible player over the years, but his discipline has been far from clean. he's been suspended in all 3 WCs he's played in. in 2002 he was red carded against senegal, and france went on to score 0 goals and not make it past 1st round - maybe you could argue he cost them the WC that year too.

or how about in 00-01 season? he was twice red carded for violent headbutts, one of them getting him 5 game suspension, and somehow, during one of his suspensions, he was awarded fifa player of the year.

What does that show to all the young kids or players who look up to him? that fifa condone's violence?

euro2004 with totti is a great example - totti's stupid reaction to being provoked resulted in suspension and mainly cost italy getting knocked out of euro. i dont think anyone, not even italians, tried to justify or condone what he did, even though he was clearly provoked

these situations have gone on forever, and the players who have retaliated physically and stupidly, have never been condoned for their actions.

at the end of the day zidane violently drove a headbutt into the guy's sternum. as stupid as materazzi is, you cant do something like that in the middle of the field

not that i've ever seen. you guys are forgetting that we are talking about WORDS.

words vs. invading someones personal space. there is such a huge difference there it's not even funny.

although its clearly not fair to use harsh words against people, your not always going to control it. even off the field, in every day life. people will always say stupid things. at the end of the day, if you physically harm someone, thats what would get you in trouble

[Cedric]

Sorry, I have just read this thread's last page. So if this has been posted before, my apologies.

http://permanent.nouvelobs.com/sport/20060710.OBS4651.html

These are Materazzi's previous few offences.

[iconoclast]

Exactly, I'm surprised how many people here don't have the balls to stand up for themselves.

There is a time and a place, like after you beat the Italians in PK's.

/edit

5 good ones

[profets]

Sorry, I have just read this thread's last page. So if this has been posted before, my apologies.

http://permanent.nouvelobs.com/sport/20060710.OBS4651.html

These are Materazzi's previous few offences.

haha,

thats the usual materazzi alright

its good to see he kept his cool in this game though

[Cedric]

I do not want in anyway to condone Zidance's actions. But it is sad to see that in football or in life, only physical attacks are looked at and punished (as they should) and not provocative verbal attacks which can be at least as hurtful.

[Nick Sheldon]

It's very unusual for a french guy to retaliate, especially when he hasn't got a white flag to hand.

[FlibbyFlobby]

Ziadoz, ekerazha:

its nice to see a few people who have different view

zidane has been an incredible player over the years, but his discipline has been far from clean. he's been suspended in all 3 WCs he's played in. in 2002 he was red carded against senegal, and france went on to score 0 goals and not make it past 1st round - maybe you could argue he cost them the WC that year too.

or how about in 00-01 season? he was twice red carded for violent headbutts, one of them getting him 5 game suspension, and somehow, during one of his suspensions, he was awarded fifa player of the year.

What does that show to all the young kids or players who look up to him? that fifa condone's violence?

euro2004 with totti is a great example - totti's stupid reaction to being provoked resulted in suspension and mainly cost italy getting knocked out of euro. i dont think anyone, not even italians, tried to justify or condone what he did, even though he was clearly provoked

these situations have gone on forever, and the players who have retaliated physically and stupidly, have never been condoned for their actions.

at the end of the day zidane violently drove a headbutt into the guy's sternum. as stupid as materazzi is, you cant do something like that in the middle of the field

although its clearly not fair to use harsh words against people, your not always going to control it. even off the field, in every day life. people will always say stupid things. at the end of the day, if you physically harm someone, thats what would get you in trouble

I agree with you totally. Everyone is defending Zidane because he has been built up by the media to be a nice (and calm) guy, therefore he can do no wrong. Despite the fact Zidane has a history of violence in the game, one which is easily equal to Materazzi's, people will defend him blindly because he was 'doing the right thing'. The right thing would have been to be an adult and walk away (he could have even shot back a few choice words of his own!), not retaliate with violence.

It needs to be known that violence is football is unacceptable, whether you are being provoked or not, and whether or not you are a football icon. Hopefully Fifa won't be a bunch of spineless morons and let Zidane get away with this unpunished, and untarnished. Although I expect Materazzi will take the blunt of it all because hes the easier of the two to blame (and Fifa are useless!) and the media love to have a villan.

[Pajter]

Verbal violence is just as wrong as, if not worse than physical violence.

[alpha_omega]

Verbal violence is just as wrong as, if not worse than physical violence.

I'm pretty sure you'll change your opinion once someone knocks you a tooth out...

[Malisk]

I'm not sure why Zidane's action is any more worthy of defense than pretty much any other physical abuse in this sport. It's the same in ice hockey, *of course* taunts often lead to direct physical violence, but that's how things are. The same goes if a player in ice hockey is taunted and spears another player in the guts. He'll get a harsh penalty for the spearing. The ref isn't going to approach someone saying "we don't use these words in my arena, son" unless it was directed at the ref.

It's like as for Zidane it's "ooh, but the ITALIAN was the bad guy! he had a foul mouth!". If an Italian had kicked Zidane in his balls, who would you think should be sent off the field then? The Italian? But come on, maybe Zidane would've said something earlier! We can only penalize people for their actions, and it's impossible for a ref to judge their words when he can't hear everything they say. The line is drawn at physical abuse, and the players know it. Zidane was stupid and why not leave it at that. Otherwise, what one need to do is to call probably most of all penalties "unfair" for being introduced by crap talk.

[Michael_C]

if you knew anything about playing football as a professional (let alone as one of the worlds top players in WC final and your final national career game), having the balls to stand up to verbal abuse by violently head-butting an opponent in the chest isnt allowed.

i think the real problem with this topic is that it occured while most of the world was watching this game, with most people not clearly understanding the sport.

I think you'll find it is the same accross all professional sports. Obviously what Zidane did broke the rules but I can understand exactly why he did it

[Cedric]

I agree with you totally. Everyone is defending Zidane because he has been built up by the media to be a nice (and calm) guy, therefore he can do no wrong. Despite the fact Zidane has a history of violence in the game, one which is easily equal to Materazzi's, people will defend him blindly because he was 'doing the right thing'. The right thing would have been to be an adult and walk away (he could have even shot back a few choice words of his own!), not retaliate with violence.

It needs to be known that violence is football is unacceptable, whether you are being provoked or not, and whether or not you are a football icon. Hopefully Fifa won't be a bunch of spineless morons and let Zidane get away with this unpunished, and untarnished. Although I expect Materazzi will take the blunt of it all because hes the easier of the two to blame (and Fifa are useless!) and the media love to have a villan.

Having had both experiences, I think I would tend to agree with Status Seeker who said "Verbal violence is just as wrong as, if not worse than physical violence"