aww poor neowin :(

[tomwarren Veteran]

There's ways we could implement to make the adverts unblockable if we really wanted to. There's also methods of making the "you blocked ads" message be there no matter what. We don't want to do those, this is just a polite reminder you're blocking ads that's all. Yes we know it's slightly slow to load and we're going to fix that so normal people won't even see it.

[neudera]

I just noticed there's an actual debate over the moral ethics of blocking ads going on.

Ah what the hell, I might as well chime in.

The problem with ads dates back to the early days of the internet. The first concept of the internet was developed by the U.S. military as a failsafe way of establishing communication if normal methods were disrupted in the midst of an attack. After they developed better means, they abandoned the idea and it wound up in the hands of very happy nerds that ran wild with the possibilities. About 10 years later the internet as we knew it first starting becoming mainstream, thanks to AOL, MindSpring, and all the other early-day ISPs.

Now, here's where ads come in. Back in the early to mid 90's, ads were almost non-existent. Certainly no where near the amount that are around today. People are bombarded left and right with ads, and the simple fact? We're tired of it. It's the same reason people hate songs that get overplayed on the radio, it's simply that, overplayed. Many people would be happy to support Neowin in a number of ways, subscriptions (obviously) being one of them. However, people are just sick of ads. They detract from the overall consistency of the layout, suck bandwidth, and in many cases slow down the browsing experience.

I white-list Neowin from Adblock, but it's the only site I do it on, and if there was any other way of supporting Neowin minus a subscription, I would do it.

[Ryoken]

Congrats you learned how to use firebug or whatever add on you used to do it it's not hard. What if instead of hoping one day you learn to quit being selfish and being a freeloader and not even just letting them show ads so they can pay for the bandwith you are using they just decided to ban you here and now and let you come back when you subscribed so they knew they would be able to pay for the bandwith you use? Oh you don't think that sounds nice of them to do? Well blocking ads on a site that you are allowed to use for free isn't nice either so i guess it could work both ways.

If they banned everyone that didn't pay, or view the ad's, this site would have a fraction of the community it has now.. Come on, it's an IT Site, you don't think most people have a browser with some sort of AdBlock installed ?

I can see their point, they need money to keep the servers up.. God knows I know, I manage enough sites at my job.. And I don't care about the image, the one at the top didn't bother me, the one on the side did just because of it's location, but nothing major..

But the attitude that if you don't pay or view ad's your a leach is just painting everyone with a Huge brush.. I said why I block them, Bandwidth, I have very little most of the time. What about the people who aren't subscribers, but help in the forums ? Make this site the information resource and helpful place that it is.. Are they all leaches if they block the ad's too ? Despite the fact that they would be adding the content that makes this site worth coming too in the first place ?

I just hate when people decide to draw a line and don't think about it in the broader sense.

[Growled Member]

Just my opinion but the ad at the top of this page is too big.

[DomZ]

Those who block the ads don't see the smilie. The people that see it, are they ones that don't block ads.

And seeing it, because the ads are too slow to load.

This is the problem, and its actually annoying me now that I'm considering installing an ad blocker because everytime I click a page I'm greeted with a sad face for a split second. I'd actually gotten used to ads (well my brain filters them out) since using Chrome as my main browser and there only recently being extensions for it.

[tomwarren Veteran]

I said why I block them, Bandwidth, I have very little most of the time.

So you block adverts cause of bandwidth? I find that a bit of a weak reason to block adverts but it's up to you and your choice. It's also up to us how we deal with ad blockers and a simple, polite message isn't in the grand scheme of things anything that should upset people. I can understand genuine people getting annoyed by the message before the advert loads but as we've stated several times in this thread this will be addressed shortly.

[Richard Hammond]

Rob has already confirmed we'll be making some improvements so that normal non-adblockers will not see the message no matter what their connection is. What's your problem here exactly?

The same reason i dont like these FACT copyright theft warnings on DVDs/Blu-rays or how i wouldnt appreciate being stopped in the street by police and them telling me stealing is illegal so dont do it, im not a leech i dont block ads, i view and click them and i dont appreciate a message insinuating that i am an adblocker.

If you guys are working on it fair enough i just dont like the attitude of staff members.

[Ryoken]

So you block adverts cause of bandwidth? I find that a bit of a weak reason to block adverts but it's up to you and your choice. It's also up to us how we deal with ad blockers and a simple, polite message isn't in the grand scheme of things anything that should upset people. I can understand genuine people getting annoyed by the message before the advert loads but as we've stated several times in this thread this will be addressed shortly.

I end the month with 5-10mb to spare (and 2-3 days of not doing much.. People forget how little 2GB is, and how quickly advertisements on sites, not just here, ad up quickly..

Even if I wanted to unblock ad's here, I do it on the HOSTS file level, so I don't waste any bandwidth on it, removing the ad sites you use would remove them everywhere.

[MikeChipshop Member]

It's not accusing you off anything stop being paranoid.

[clotz2000]

Adblockers are a waste of time, I don't mind ads Most-if not all of the time. The only ads that absolutely annoy me are the ones where a chick starts talking in a highly annoying voice whilst my pc speakers are up full blast from listening to music and then about a minute later it throws a video playing up in front of the web page about the "Ab Destroyer Pro 90XGT"

I think having ads on most sites is great for the site, just keep the really bad ones off and no one will have an issue (well it's likely someone will have an issue) but you get the idea

[Joel]

The same reason i dont like these FACT copyright theft warnings on DVDs/Blu-rays or how i wouldnt appreciate being stopped in the street by police and them telling me stealing is illegal so dont do it, im not a leech i dont block ads, i view and click them and i dont appreciate a message insinuating that i am an adblocker.

If you guys are working on it fair enough i just dont like the attitude of staff members.

Did you stop buying movies? Or even write a letter to the studios, demanding an alternative to the copyright warnings?

[carmatic]

We ask people to don't be a dick and block a stream of revenue that provides for this site, staff and covers event costs. It's pretty straight forward isn't it?

its not my fault if the ads dont show when i am not doing anything to block it

[Richard Hammond]

Did you stop buying movies? Or even write a letter to the studios, demanding an alternative to the copyright warnings?

No i just rip the movies from the disc to store on my media server therefor bypassing these messages, i could adblock both adverts and the messages and be on my way but as i said i have no issues with the adverts.

[simonlang]

someone can tell me how to quickly whitelist neowin.net on firefox adblock-plus extension?

[Joel]

someone can tell me how to quickly whitelist neowin.net on firefox adblock-plus extension?

Right-click on the Adblock icon and select disable on neowin.net.

No i just rip the movies from the disc to store on my media server therefor bypassing these messages, i could adblock both adverts and the messages and be on my way but as i said i have no issues with the adverts.

So now you break the law to bypass the copyright notice. Hmmm.

[Ryoken]

So now you break the law to bypass the copyright notice. Hmmm.

In most of the world that falls under Fair Use, as you are not selling, or showing to others.

[simonlang]

Right-click on the Adblock icon and select disable on neowin.net.

thx! that was it. i think i can live with that ad banner on top of the forum as long as neowin wont get totally covered by ads like other websites im fine with it. :yes:

[Joel]

In most of the world that falls under Fair Use, as you are not selling, or showing to others.

You'd be surprised what we THINK is legal when it's actually not. You're not allowed to break the copy-protection embedded on DVDs. If you can't do that, you can't make a copy.

[wahoospa]

I see nothing wrong with the ad showing on Neowin. It is probably just a reminder that a little help occasionally would be appreciated. I have seen it only once and I spend a minute or two to check out what the advertisers have to offer from time to time. Besides, the guys here put out some good money to upgrade the site. I do not ad-block sites that I appreciate so there will be no ad blocking on here from me.

Besides that we don't want our favorites sites going the way of the New York Times someday.

[Richard Hammond]

So now you break the law to bypass the copyright notice. Hmmm.

Yep, i paid for my disc i will do what i want with it, throw me in jail for bypassing AACS and BD+..........

[Ryoken]

You'd be surprised what we THINK is legal when it's actually not. You're not allowed to break the copy-protection embedded on DVDs. If you can't do that, you can't make a copy.

And you'd be amazed at what is "illegal" but will never hold up in a court of law. First as I said, it's not illegal, it may break the terms you agreed too, but them being able to sue you != criminal act.

They can sue me, and anyone else who Rip's CD,s DVD's, HDDVD's, or Blurays to their HDD, but in most of the world without intent to resell or anything, it will be thrown out as a nuisance suit.

If it doesn't hold up in court, then it doesn't mater what they say.

[Joel]

Yep, i paid for my disc i will do what i want with it, throw me in jail for bypassing AACS and BD+..........

Did the movie cost you $0.01? If not, you paid for more than the disc.

And you'd be amazed at what is "illegal" but will never hold up in a court of law. First as I said, it's not illegal, it may break the terms you agreed too, but them being able to sue you != criminal act.

They can sue me, and anyone else who Rip's CD,s DVD's, HDDVD's, or Blurays to their HDD, but in most of the world without intent to resell or anything, it will be thrown out as a nuisance suit.

If it doesn't hold up in court, then it doesn't mater what they say.

Amazing how the very warnings he's saying he bypasses now state otherwise. Want to try again?

"The Digital Millennium Copyright Act (DMCA) is a United States copyright law that implements two 1996 treaties of the World Intellectual Property Organization (WIPO). It criminalizes production and dissemination of technology, devices, or services intended to circumvent measures (commonly known as digital rights management or DRM) that control access to copyrighted works. It also criminalizes the act of circumventing an access control, whether or not there is actual infringement of copyright itself."

[Ryoken]

Amazing how the very warnings he's saying he bypasses now state otherwise. Want to try again?

"The Digital Millennium Copyright Act (DMCA) is a United States copyright law that implements two 1996 treaties of the World Intellectual Property Organization (WIPO). It criminalizes production and dissemination of technology, devices, or services intended to circumvent measures (commonly known as digital rights management or DRM) that control access to copyrighted works. It also criminalizes the act of circumventing an access control, whether or not there is actual infringement of copyright itself."

Amazing how you take me saying WORLD and make that mean United States.

DMCA == USA. There is a lot more to the world than the United States of America.

Also his profile says UK.

[Joel]

Amazing how you take me saying WORLD and make that mean United States.

DMCA == USA. There is a lot more to the world than the United States of America.

Also his profile says UK.

It's also illegal in the UK. Sorry to **** on your parade. Canada's standing is still a grey area.

[Shadrack]

Wow, did this topic diverge OT or what?

Don't discuss illegal activity on a public message board is always a good Internet rule to live by.

To those who are debating legality and point accusing fingers: yeah right, like you have never ever illegally copied anything in your entire life... (I find that very hard to believe).