Tesla Cybertruck

[DocM]

On 10/01/2024 at 16:59, virtorio said:

People might not know what's being conveyed by that, but it's not confusing.
On the CT, it seems like the smaller red bar and illuminated indicator lights means braking?

 

NHTSA* approved the CT configuration, and they are the agency which sets the standards. 

* National Highway Traffic Safety Administration

[+virtorio MVC]

On 11/01/2024 at 11:35, DocM said:

 

NHTSA* approved the CT configuration, and they are the agency which sets the standards. 

* National Highway Traffic Safety Administration

Well if a government agency thinks it's good, then it must be good.

[DocM]

On 10/01/2024 at 17:44, virtorio said:

Well if a government agency thinks it's good, then it must be good.

Well, I wouldn't go that far. They're mostly worried about spacing, a certain number of square inches, hide off the ground, brightness, etc.

On the other hand, they made us wait ~30 years for quartz headlights, and they still won't let automakers replace exterior rear view mirrors with TV cameras - which is becoming common everywhere else.

At least they let Tesla and a few others introduce drive by wire; no mechanical connection between the steering wheel and steering gear, it's like a gaming force feedback steering wheel on steroids plus electronic and mechanical redundancy.

Edited January 10, 2024 by DocM

[Matthew S.]

On 10/01/2024 at 18:30, DocM said:

 

At least they let Tesla and a few others introduce drive by wire; no mechanical connection between the steering wheel and steering gear, it's like a gaming force feedback steering wheel on steroids plus electronic and mechanical redundancy.

That is the single most stupid thing I can think of for a car/trucks design.  So if you loose all power and are rolling down a hill ###### being able to steer.

[adrynalyne]

On 10/01/2024 at 16:47, Matthew S. said:

That is the single most stupid thing I can think of for a car/trucks design.  So if you loose all power and are rolling down a hill ###### being able to steer.

Not to mention no mechanical connection has been shown to well....suck. Drive by wire is garbage.

[Jim K Global Moderator]

On 10/01/2024 at 17:30, DocM said:

At least they let Tesla and a few others introduce drive by wire; no mechanical connection between the steering wheel and steering gear, it's like a gaming force feedback steering wheel on steroids plus electronic and mechanical redundancy.

* At least they let Nissan and a few others introduce drive by wire ...

*fixed for you.  Nissan started this about a decade ago in mass produced vehicles. 

 

On 10/01/2024 at 17:47, Matthew S. said:

That is the single most stupid thing I can think of for a car/trucks design.  So if you loose all power and are rolling down a hill ###### being able to steer.

I'm sure there will be a backup clutch that links the steering wheel to the car's wheels...just in case. 

[+virtorio MVC]

On 11/01/2024 at 12:30, DocM said:

At least they let Tesla and a few others introduce drive by wire; no mechanical connection between the steering wheel and steering gear, it's like a gaming force feedback steering wheel on steroids plus electronic and mechanical redundancy.

So, a loss of power, connection failure, component failure, corrosion on some contact, and hundreds of other potential failures mean you could lose steering?

Groundbreaking stuff.

Edit: Just to be clear, as I don't like Tesla - my criticism of this applies to other manufactures as well, not just because Tesla is doing it.

[DocM]

On 10/01/2024 at 19:00, virtorio said:

So, a loss of power, connection failure,

Redundant power supply. There's a separate accessory lithium battery in the vehicle which can supply accessory equipment, or drive a high power system like a winch. In the Cybertruck, and future Tesla  vehicles, this is not a 12 volt system but a 48 volt. High power. 

 

On 10/01/2024 at 19:00, virtorio said:

component failure,

 

Redundant actuators, one fails and the other can continue. Of course you get a warning light.

 

On 10/01/2024 at 19:00, virtorio said:

corrosion on some contact, and hundreds of other

 

Multi-string redundancy of the control path, one goes out and the others vote it off the island if/until it reboots and passes tests.

 

On 10/01/2024 at 19:00, virtorio said:

potential failures mean you could lose steering?

The odds would be greater of a collapsible steering column (stops drivers from being impaled during front end collisions) spontaneously separating in half at the slip joint.

 

On 10/01/2024 at 19:00, virtorio said:

Groundbreaking stuff.

 

A similar system, fly by wire, has been used in airliners and other aircraft since the 1980s. Best prepare yourself, because braking by wire is also a thing.

 

On 10/01/2024 at 19:00, virtorio said:

Edit: Just to be clear, as I don't like Tesla - my criticism of this applies to other manufactures as well, not just because Tesla is doing it.

 

Understood, but be aware that these redundant systems are used in modern  spacecraft because it makes them highly reliable.

The most extensive use of them in a passenger vehicle is SpaceX's Dragon, which NASA uses to fly astronauts to the space station, and it also flies commercial spaceflight missions. Highly reliable, reusable, even the Russians like it enough that their cosmonauts fly on it.

[Matthew S.]

On 10/01/2024 at 18:50, adrynalyne said:

Not to mention no mechanical connection has been shown to well....suck. Drive by wire is garbage.

Bad enough that most modern vehicles use DBW for the throttle, I have both a 2018 Mazda3 and Mazda CX9, the CX9 has instant throttle response, the Mazda3 I have to "double tap" to get the same response.

 

My old 2012 Mazda5 has better throttle response than the 3 and that has a traditional throttle linkage.

 

On 10/01/2024 at 19:34, DocM said:

A similar system, fly by wire, has been used in airliners and other aircraft since the 1980s. Best prepare yourself, because braking by wire is also a thing.

The FBW systems in aircraft (mainly only used by Airbus btw) have been tested over many decades and are a REFINED system, they also have to pass far more stringent certifications than with the auto industry, want to know one caveat with them?  No feedback, that's one of the major complaints by Airbus pilots, is you feel nothing in the stick.

[DocM]

On 10/01/2024 at 20:08, Matthew S. said:

Bad enough that most modern vehicles use DBW for the throttle, I have both a 2018 Mazda3 and Mazda CX9, the CX9 has instant throttle response, the Mazda3 I have to "double tap" to get the same response.

 

My old 2012 Mazda5 has better throttle response than the 3 and that has a traditional throttle linkage.

 

The FBW systems in aircraft (mainly only used by Airbus btw) have been tested over many decades and are a REFINED system, they also have to pass far more stringent certifications than with the auto industry, want to know one caveat with them?  No feedback, that's one of the major complaints by Airbus pilots, is you feel nothing in the stick.

What you're missing is the synergy between Tesla and SpaceX.

This started by sharing a Materials Science department but it's gone much further. When Tesla develops redundant systems they can tap into SpaceX's experience in building and qualifying redundant systems for use with NASA and the DoD - they run throughout their launchers, and their spacecraft. Tesla Energy provides SpaceX with  batteries and power systems. Cybertrucks steel was developed by SpaceX.

[DeathLace]

On 10/01/2024 at 13:15, DocM said:

 

According to the YouTube video the driver was in Montana, Snow & Ice Central, driving with all terrain tires which are inadequate for those conditions. Ask any Michigan yooper.

Once again, I live in Canada, where we get more snow. I see sedans driving around, including my own, with all season tires, that can easily drive through under a foot of snow.

Don't you get tired of making excuses for every failures of the people you worship?

You never want accountability.

It's the "independent"/republican way.

[hagjohn]

On 11/01/2024 at 10:25, DeathLace said:

Once again, I live in Canada, where we get more snow. I see sedans driving around, including my own, with all season tires, that can easily drive through under a foot of snow.

Don't you get tired of making excuses for every failures of the people you worship?

You never want accountability.

It's the "independent"/republican way.

I just can't handle all this Musk masturbation. It is a bit creepy.

[Matthew S.]

On 10/01/2024 at 18:53, Jim K said:

I'm sure there will be a backup clutch that links the steering wheel to the car's wheels...just in case. 

This is Tesla and Musk we're talking about, bright they ain't.

[Matthew S.]

On 10/01/2024 at 13:15, DocM said:

 

According to the YouTube video the driver was in Montana, Snow & Ice Central, driving with all terrain tires which are inadequate for those conditions. Ask any Michigan yooper.

You don't get the lake effect snow that Lambton county does, take a hop over the bridge once the snow really starts and go up 21.

[DocM]

On 11/01/2024 at 15:58, Matthew S. said:

This is Tesla and Musk we're talking about, bright they ain't.

It's not just Tesla and Musk, drive by wire is going to be seen across the industry. Also Toyota, Lexus, Geely (Chinese maker which owns Volvo), Canoo (US EV truck maker)...growing list

[DocM]

On 11/01/2024 at 16:00, Matthew S. said:

You don't get the lake effect snow that Lambton county does, take a hop over the bridge once the snow really starts and go up 21.

I've spent a lot of time in the up, which is why I referred him to ask a yooper about snow. You guys have seen a max of 355 in, Montana more like 850.

My whole point was that the standard tire on most Cybertrucks are ATs which are  inadequate for snow over ice (esp. black ice) or deep snow.  

[DocM]

On 11/01/2024 at 12:46, hagjohn said:

I just can't handle all this Musk masturbation. It is a bit creepy.

 

And here I thought we were having an adult conversation about tires and snow in a part of the board that's not designated for politics. Silly me. You just can't help yourself.

I don't care where in Canada you live, in much of Michigan and in Montana driving without snow tires in the winter is for fools who want to get stuck.

[adrynalyne]

On 11/01/2024 at 15:26, DocM said:

 

And here I thought we were having an adult conversation about tires and snow in a part of the board that's not designated for politics. Silly me. You just can't help yourself.

We were. You didn’t listen to anyone but yourself and the gospel of Musk. Any surprise that the conversation devolved because of it?

[DocM]

On 11/01/2024 at 17:27, adrynalyne said:

We were. You didn’t listen to anyone but yourself and the gospel of Musk. Any surprise that the conversation devolved because of it?

The topic of the threat is about Cybertruck, steered off course by the usual anti Musk hate using memes, political commentary, and 5th grade talk about masturbation. There's already a thread for that.

As for the rest, I thought personal attacks were against the tos? Guess that's why so many adults have left the building.

 

[adrynalyne]

On 11/01/2024 at 16:01, DocM said:

The topic of the threat is about Cybertruck, steered off course by the usual anti Musk hate using memes, political commentary, and 5th grade talk about masturbation. There's already a thread for that.

As for the rest, I thought personal attacks were against the tos? Guess that's why so many adults have left the building.

 

That’s a pretty hypocritical response there bud. 

[hagjohn]

On 11/01/2024 at 17:26, DocM said:

 

And here I thought we were having an adult conversation about tires and snow in a part of the board that's not designated for politics. Silly me. You just can't help yourself.

I don't care where in Canada you live, in much of Michigan and in Montana driving without snow tires in the winter is for fools who want to get stuck.

It is hard having an adult discussion with you.  You refuse to hear any criticism of the rich men you worship. Musk has some good business sense but it usually is over shadowed by his erratic emotional state. You cannot deny that.

[+virtorio MVC]

On 11/01/2024 at 13:34, DocM said:

...

I trust that airlines are keeping their aircraft properly maintained. People hit poles and never bother to get the damage fixed, drive through bodies of water - or get flooded (resulting in water going where it's not designed to go), fail to wash off salt and ignore maintenance schedules and warning lights. And sometimes they'll sell cars that have had these things happen and not disclose any of it.

I know there's nothing I can do about it, I'm just pessimistic about the reliability, safety (when core operating features could just fail while driving with no mechanical override) and lifespan of modern cars.

Don't people at SpaceX cheer and celebrate when their rockets explode? (I don't follow rocket launches, maybe their supposed to explode, I don't know)

[adrynalyne]

On 11/01/2024 at 17:34, hagjohn said:

It is hard having an adult discussion with you.  You refuse to hear any criticism of the rich men you worship. Musk has some good business sense but it usually is over shadowed by his erratic emotional state. You cannot deny that.

Yes he can and that’s the problem. 

[wakjak]

Can't drive the truck if the screen goes caput. lol. Good luck with the CyberFail.

[Jaybonaut]

Don't condemn Tesla for Elon's ridiculous behavior.  There is some very hard working people there.

 

...but as far as the ridiculous behavior goes:  https://www.msn.com/en-us/news/technology/elon-musk-cosigns-racist-claim-that-black-students-have-low-iqs/ar-AA1mOLVQ?ocid=msedgdhp&pc=U531&cvid=57077e73671441199aec084670aaa7d7&ei=39