Malaysia Airlines 'loses contact with plane' (and search effort updates)

[Hum]

^ It could be for someone's private use -- sold for profit.

 

It could be used to transport 'soldiers' and weapons.

 

It could be used to load up with explosives, and crashed into some target, months from now.

 

 

 

I doubt anything will be found in the India ocean.

 

If flight 370 had a controlled landing, I think it was relatively near Maylasia.

[Hum]

Some possible landing sites:

 

[Dot Matrix]

"Two U.S. officials tell ABC News the U.S. believes that the shutdown of two communication systems happened separately on Malaysia Airlines Flight 370. One source said this indicates the plane did not come out of the sky because of a catastrophic failure.

The data reporting system, they believe, was shut down at 1:07 a.m. The transponder -- which transmits location and altitude -- shut down at 1:21 a.m.

This indicates it may well have been a deliberate act, ABC News aviation consultant John Nance said.

U.S. investigators told ABC News that the two modes of communication were "systematically shut down."

That means the U.S. team "is convinced that there was manual intervention," a source said, which means it was likely not an accident or catastrophic malfunction that took the plane out of the sky."

 

http://abcnews.go.com/International/malaysia-airliner-pinging-indication-crashed-indian-ocean/story?id=22894802

[kaffra]

http://www.businessweek.com/articles/2014-03-12/why-malaysia-will-say-almost-nothing-about-the-missing-flight

looks like the typical anti malay articles by the minorities there. i found it particularly funny the article complains about malays 6 prime ministers since countries formation. Singapore is the same age, only had 3 and the current one is the son of the first.

[Nashy]

Did this aircraft have an air marshal on board?  Do Malaysia use them?

Are they searching over the jungles?  Or are they only focused in the ocean?
 

Malaysia don't seem to know how to look after an emergency of this magnitude, that's not to sink the boot in, I doubt many countries know how to deal with a massive plane just vanishing.  It just seems funny though, that they are very quick to deny things, but then jump on the other foot and say they don't know what happened.

 

For people saying it was hijacked and landed for another use, it's not a stupid theory that it could have happened, but as said in the thread, it's going to take a lot of work to know the plane, and to get into a position where you are in control of the plane.  There are 12 crew members (not sure if that includes the guys up front of not), and many, many passengers.  They then need to fly undetected through military and civilian radar, and they need to fly into a field big enough to take a 772, and know it's not controlled, or in controlled air space where it will be detected.

If they are that smart, they would surely know that you can't get away with stealing a passenger jetliner.  How long can it go undetected for once they start using it?  You can't sell the parts, they are all able to be traced back to that AC, easily.  As soon as they turn the comms on (if they do) Boeing will know it's operational.

 

 

Until more info comes out, of course I'm only speculating.  But I think it was a decompression, not a destructive one, as it's very unlikely given aircraft are built to break in certain squares in the fuselage to stop the plane going down (think Southwest 737 recently).

I think everyone passed out due to a pressurisation issue on the plane.  Be that a hole in the skin or the pressure system not being set to auto (Helios situation).  It wouldn't be a stretch for the pilots to feel tired at 1am (They do get tired, the airlines just like to make you think they don't).  They fell asleep, one of them slumped on the yoke, disengaging the auto pilot, turning the airctaft, and possibly making him fall off the yoke, for the plane to keep going, and slowly decend into the ocean.

It still doesn't explain no debris, and it doesn't explain the ACARS and transponder being turned off.

It's all very odd.

It makes me (a regular airline passenger) very anxious about my flight tomorrow on board a 747.

[Mr. Gibs]

like how china provided  satelite images of the supposed wreckage? malaysia and vietnam sent in SAR to the location the chinese provided and found nothing

So? It's a picture from a satellite, nobody said it was 100% authenticated and verified to be MH370 and that everyone should follow it. They had a lead, they verified it and it didn't pan out. Malaysia, on the other hand:

1. Has constantly kept information quiet and released it 2 days later or released it to the media without informing their own search partners. Vietnam has said multiple times now that Malaysia hasn't been open with them on the information they receive.

2. Have constantly backpedaled on the information they gave. One day they'll say one thing, the next day they'll say something else and claim the previous information was false even though it came from them, and then the third day they'll go back to the first thing they said and go "this is what we really meant"

3. They wasted 5+ hours of search time because they initially didn't release the right time of disappearance even though every other source disagreed with them. I understand that they were extremely busy but that 5 hours could have been crucial.

4. "Lied" In one of their early press interviews the director of the DCA claimed that ACARS didn't give out any abnormal signals before the plane disappeared. Then after half the internet went "what? The plane didn't have any ACARS system" in the next interview he then says "no the plane didn't have ACARS on board"

5. Malaysia Airlines support team that they sent to Beijing was a failure. Some of the members didn't speak mandarin and only spoke broken English.

Malaysia has screwed up a lot more than China has even though the plane that vanished was their very own flag carrier.

[Praetor]

So? It's a picture from a satellite, nobody said it was 100% authenticated and verified to be MH370 and that everyone should follow it. They had a lead, they verified it and it didn't pan out. Malaysia, on the other hand:

1. Has constantly kept information quiet and released it 2 days later or released it to the media without informing their own search partners. Vietnam has said multiple times now that Malaysia hasn't been open with them on the information they receive.

2. Have constantly backpedaled on the information they gave. One day they'll say one thing, the next day they'll say something else and claim the previous information was false even though it came from them, and then the third day they'll go back to the first thing they said and go "this is what we really meant"

3. They wasted 5+ hours of search time because they initially didn't release the right time of disappearance even though every other source disagreed with them. I understand that they were extremely busy but that 5 hours could have been crucial.

4. "Lied" In one of their early press interviews the director of the DCA claimed that ACARS didn't give out any abnormal signals before the plane disappeared. Then after half the internet went "what? The plane didn't have any ACARS system" in the next interview he then says "no the plane didn't have ACARS on board"

5. Malaysia Airlines support team that they sent to Beijing was a failure. Some of the members didn't speak mandarin and only spoke broken English.

Malaysia has screwed up a lot more than China has even though the plane that vanished was their very own flag carrier.

 

this is really becoming a cluster ######.

[riahc3]

Did this aircraft have an air marshal on board?

Actually believe it or not, air marshals are usually assigned to flights that are suspicious.

What I mean by this is that a flight with a adjusted amount of fuel from a short distance between towns a air marshal is usually not assigned. Now a LA to NY flight would have one.

This is to the best of my knowledge; After 9/11, I believe indeed all flights did have air marshals like you comment.

(BTW, you and I are talking about the US and its in/out flights. No clue other countries)

[Nashy]

Actually believe it or not, air marshals are usually assigned to flights that are suspicious.

What I mean by this is that a flight with a adjusted amount of fuel from a short distance between towns a air marshal is usually not assigned. Now a LA to NY flight would have one.

This is to the best of my knowledge; After 9/11, I believe indeed all flights did have air marshals like you comment.

(BTW, you and I are talking about the US and its in/out flights. No clue other countries)

 

I'm not sure about US air marshals.  I don't even know if here in Australia we still have them or not.

Would be interesting to know.

[Skiver Veteran]

I agree, but not everyone travels with just the battery in their phone so it had to be said.

Whilst I can understand all of that... if its an old phone that simply doesnt require charge then fine, but if its something newer that involves swapping batteries, are we really saying that someone is going through the 2 minutes it would take to swap the battery to keep their phone alive, but just by chance are "missing" these calls and then not returning them?

 

I think the HLR ringing theory is probably the closest theory as to why that happened, if it even happened given the amount of stories that come out and then are quickly dismissed!

[Hum]

BEIJING, March 14 (Xinhua) -- Chinese researchers have detected a "seafloor event" near the waters between Malaysia and Vietnam, an area suspected to be linked with the missing Malaysian jetliner MH370, a university announced on Friday.

 

The event occurred at about 2:55 a.m. local time on Saturday, about one and a half hours after the plane's last definitive sighting on civilian radar, according to a research group on seismology and physics of the earth's interior under the University of Science and Technology of China.

 

The area, 116 km northeast from where the last contact with the Boeing plane was recorded, used to be a non-seismic region, the group said.

 

"The seafloor event could have been caused by the plane possibly plunging into the sea," the research group said.

 

The location of the event was identified based on records of two seismographs located in Malaysia.

 

If the data is proved to be linked to the missing flight, "the strength of the earthquake wave indicates the plunge was catastrophic," according to the research group.

 

http://news.xinhuanet.com/english/china/2014-03/14/c_133186204.htm

[macoman]

If it's true, how the airplane didn't broke in pieces?

[watkinsx2]

BEIJING, March 14 (Xinhua) -- Chinese researchers have detected a "seafloor event" near the waters between Malaysia and Vietnam, an area suspected to be linked with the missing Malaysian jetliner MH370, a university announced on Friday.

 

The event occurred at about 2:55 a.m. local time on Saturday, about one and a half hours after the plane's last definitive sighting on civilian radar, according to a research group on seismology and physics of the earth's interior under the University of Science and Technology of China.

 

The area, 116 km northeast from where the last contact with the Boeing plane was recorded, used to be a non-seismic region, the group said.

 

"The seafloor event could have been caused by the plane possibly plunging into the sea," the research group said.

 

The location of the event was identified based on records of two seismographs located in Malaysia.

 

If the data is proved to be linked to the missing flight, "the strength of the earthquake wave indicates the plunge was catastrophic," according to the research group.

 

http://news.xinhuanet.com/english/china/2014-03/14/c_133186204.htm

 

 

You would think that they would have found some debris in this case unless they are looking in the wrong place? With AF447 they found debris after less than 48 hours and that was almost in the middle of the south atlantic!

[Hum]

If it's true, how the airplane didn't broke in pieces?

 

^ Maybe it depends on the angle it hit the sea.

 

I wonder what they were doing for the hour & a half.

[macoman]

^ Maybe it depends on the angle it hit the sea.

I wonder what they were doing for the hour & a half.

So if the airplane hit the sea straight down, like head on directly to the sea... It will just submerge and not signs of anything?

[watkinsx2]

So if the airplane hit the sea straight down, like head on directly to the sea... It will just submerge and not signs of anything?

 

 

Straight down? No. At that speed water is fairly solid and it would break up on impact. Im guessing Hum is thinking of some sort of controlled landing where the plane sank afterwards.

[macoman]

Straight down? No. At that speed water is fairly solid and it would break up on impact. Im guessing Hum is thinking of some sort of controlled landing where the plane sank afterwards.

Like the Hudson river accident? Which basically the airplane didn't broke and just floated. But I will think, if that was the case, they will be calling for help which never happened.

[philcruicks]

Straight down? No. At that speed water is fairly solid and it would break up on impact. Im guessing Hum is thinking of some sort of controlled landing where the plane sank afterwards.

Would explain the time delay as the plane would easily travelled 116km in less than 1:30h...but it goes against the seismologists report that it was a large impact....

 

Agreed, at any high speed water becomes essentially solid and a plane would disintegrate on impact, it would not continue on straight down to the sea bed intact.

[Hum]

So if the airplane hit the sea straight down, like head on directly to the sea... It will just submerge and not signs of anything?

I would think there would still be an oil/fuel slick on the surface.

 

Maybe strong currents carried it away.

 

And the 'black' boxes would activate.

[riahc3]

Question: Is there a reason there isn't a GPS transmitter (not receiver) on these planes?

[mudslag]

Question: Is there a reason there isn't a GPS transmitter (not receiver) on these planes?

 

 

 

Airplanes use transponders.

[Nashy]

I would think there would still be an oil/fuel slick on the surface.

 

Maybe strong currents carried it away.

 

And the 'black' boxes would activate.

Black boxes would be activated, they only have a range of around 2km.

If anything, this issue is showing that there are a lot of deficiencies in airline tracking.

There are meant to be redundancies in place, yet when the transponder is switched off, all tracking is gone.

We have GPS tracking in cars, but not in planes apparently.

We can save some of the most pointless ###### in the cloud.  But not plane data.

I see some really, really major changes to tracking of aircraft to come from this. 

Question: Is there a reason there isn't a GPS transmitter (not receiver) on these planes?

 

As far as I'm aware, they have them.  But they are operated via the transponder, which was turned off.

[Chris123NT]

BEIJING, March 14 (Xinhua) -- Chinese researchers have detected a "seafloor event" near the waters between Malaysia and Vietnam, an area suspected to be linked with the missing Malaysian jetliner MH370, a university announced on Friday.

 

The event occurred at about 2:55 a.m. local time on Saturday, about one and a half hours after the plane's last definitive sighting on civilian radar, according to a research group on seismology and physics of the earth's interior under the University of Science and Technology of China.

 

The area, 116 km northeast from where the last contact with the Boeing plane was recorded, used to be a non-seismic region, the group said.

 

"The seafloor event could have been caused by the plane possibly plunging into the sea," the research group said.

 

The location of the event was identified based on records of two seismographs located in Malaysia.

 

If the data is proved to be linked to the missing flight, "the strength of the earthquake wave indicates the plunge was catastrophic," according to the research group.

 

http://news.xinhuanet.com/english/china/2014-03/14/c_133186204.htm

I dunno If I would trust anything the Chinese say at this point, seeing how they were BSing about that floating debris.

 

^ Maybe it depends on the angle it hit the sea.

 

I wonder what they were doing for the hour & a half.

They were talking about Jesus?

 

Ok maybe that's a bit of a harsh joke but I'm trying to lighten the mood :P.  And a plane hitting water is like smashing into solid concrete, it would have broken into pieces.

[Nashy]

I don't believe the Chinese were bullshitting.  From the report I've read, they put forward a lead, and told Malaysia to NOT release it as it was NOT confirmed or known if it was a debris field.  The fantastic suits in Malaysia decided to release it anyway.

[Mugwump00]

Black boxes would be activated, they only have a range of around 2km.

 

 

Really - citation?  I thought they were both radio and sonar transmitters - 2k is not very deep for the open ocean - the Marianas trench is 11km deep.