Malaysia Airlines 'loses contact with plane' (and search effort updates)

[kaffra]

Er no sorry they haven't. My post wasn't even about speculation, but keep trying.

 

i dont need to try anything, if you want to ignore vietnams speculations on oils spils, rafts and what nots thats your choice..

 

Except that it wasn't about barging in.

Malaysia initially gave the wrong time of disappearance, then 5 hours later they put out a new report saying "sorry the old one was wrong, the plane disappeared at this time".

the intiatial report did get the timing wrong, many people didnt realise there is a 1hr diffrence between local times, and malaysia cant barge into other territories.

 

That's a pathetic excuse. You have 240 people on board a plane that are missing, if he can't speak properly or has no idea what he was talking about put someone else in charge and let them do the talking.

what did he say? as i said i didnt understand him and cant comment

 

 

Yet another pathetic excuse. If tomorrow your family went missing I'll be sure to send someone who doesn't speak a word of your language to help support you. Then you can hire a translator because that would make you feel so good.

 

ooh poor you, everything is a pathetic excuse, only you are right. as i a ready said the chinese are expecting too much as if malaysia needs to bow down to them. just like their bullying in the region. dont need to bring personal family things into this discussion. if anybody went missing, ill be glad its not from the bumbling "superpower" can cant even get its intel right from all its spy satelites. All this noise from the chinese is to hide their own incompetance, they are also involved with the SAR.

 

 

Code share means nothing. It was a malaysian airlines plane PERIOD. And it's because Vietnam and China haven't been acting out of the sheer incompetence that Malaysia has been.

then leave the SAR and do it themselves, or maybe they would like to spy and copy the american tech also involved in the SAR.

---

Sorry but this is just a fact. Either Malaysia has something to hide or they are just that incompetent. At first when this story came out I supported the Malaysians, I figured that they have a lot on their plate and mistakes can happen and do happen. But every ####ing day it's another screw up coming out of their mouths.

First it was 2 people with stolen passports, then it became 4 people, then it became 2 people who were Asian, then it became 2 people who looked like italians, then it became oh 5 people didn't board and had their bags removed, then it became oh no wait those 5 people were on the plane, and so on. How the #### do you not even know who boarded and who didn't board the plane?

Sure there has been wrong information out of Vietnam and China but they didn't turn around and deny everything 2 mins later. Malaysia says one thing and then 2 mins later says the complete opposite.

Now you have information coming out that Malaysia has satellite and radar evidence that the plane flew for hours, where the #### was this radar evidence a week ago? It's not like a radar site just magically appeared and was like "sorry I'm late, here's the information you were looking for" Oh but wait, 2 hours later the DCA denies it.

--------------

i guess when you read the speculative news and confuse it with the official PC then some confusion is to be expected.

like how malaysian PM  says its a it seems that the plane was deliberately turned, media speculates its hijacking. then theres a report saying DCA chief denies hijacking,

Malaysian PM carefully avoided saying the word hijacked. now people  accuse them of being inconsistent and backtracking?

 

 

 

 

[kaffra]

Sure if it stayed constantly far from shore and out of range of radar then it would effectively be invisible. But you have a lot of theories going on that the plane flew over land, in which case it would have been picked up by primary radar especially in countries like India that have radar technology.

If that plane entered a country that had radar it would have been picked up, ATC won't just go "oh look a random plane flying in from abroad with no identification or squawk code, I'll just ignore it and make some tea"

 

"In Thailand, secondary surveillance radar, which requires a signal from aircraft, runs 24 hours a day, but primary surveillance radar, which requires no signal at all, ordinarily shuts down at night, said a Royal Thai Air Force officer who asked not to be named because he is not authorized to talk to the media on the issue

 

Air Marshal Vinod Patni, a retired Indian air force officer and a defense expert, said radar facilities in the Andaman and Nicobar Islands area don?t work around the clock, either. ?These are generally switched on and off as and when required. A radar may be kept on for 24 hours on certain days. I won?t say that the Indian radars are highly sophisticated in the region,? he said.

 

Patni also said there are gaps in the coverage areas, including within the area being searched for the missing plane. He couldn?t give an exact location for specific gaps, but said pilots are well aware of them."

 

http://washington.cbslocal.com/2014/03/14/malaysian-official-we-are-looking-at-sabotage-with-hijack-still-on-the-cards/

[Mr. Gibs]

i dont need to try anything, if you want to ignore vietnams speculations on oils spils, rafts and what nots thats your choice..

Except THATS HOW INVESTIGATIONS ARE CONDUCTED.

They found a lead, they followed it, found it didn't pan out, moved on.

 

ooh poor you, everything is a pathetic excuse, only you are right. as i a ready said the chinese are expecting too much as if malaysia needs to bow down to them. just like their bullying in the region. dont need to bring personal family things into this discussion. if anybody went missing, ill be glad its not from the bumbling "superpower" can cant even get its intel right from all its spy satelites. All this noise from the chinese is to hide their own incompetance, they are also involved with the SAR.

Uh huh read my first post.

China hasn't been constantly screwing up and denying claims and hiding information. They found a lead, followed it and then when nothing happened nothing happened. It's a giant ocean obviously everything they find won't be relevant but they still have to go look.

I also never said the Malaysians have to bow down to China but keep putting words in my mouth and defending what is increasingly looking like a throughly incompetent leadership from Malaysia.

 

then leave the SAR and do it themselves, or maybe they would like to spy and copy the american tech also involved in the SAR.

That's pretty much what the countries have started doing after realizing how incompetent Malaysia is. China also joined the search well before the US did.

 

i guess when you read the speculative news and confuse it with the official PC then some confusion is to be expected.

like how malaysian PM says its a it seems that the plane was deliberately turned, media speculates its hijacking. then theres a report saying DCA chief denies hijacking,

Malaysian PM carefully avoided saying the word hijacked. now people accuse them of being inconsistent and backtracking?

Malaysian PM did just say that the plane turned but the DCA said it was a deliberate hijacking. That's why the media pounced on the word hijacking, because thats how #### the major news networks are.

But take my example of the people on board.

First, two people with stolen passports. Then that became 4 people with stolen passports. Then that became 2 people with stolen passports who were Asian. Then that became 2 people who looked Italian. Then that became 5 people didn't board the plane and had their bags removed. Then that became 5 people did board the plane and their bags weren't removed. Explain that without using the word incompetence go on.

---

You can blame Vietnam all you want, but here's the dirty truth. Vietnam has nothing to lose, it wasn't their plane, it wasn't their pilots, it wasn't their citizens, it wasn't their flag airline company and most likely the plane didn't even enter their water or their country. And yet they're helping out.

Malaysia? It was THEIR plane, pilots, crew, some passengers, their flag carrier, plane left their airport and was still on their radar screen when it disappeared. And yet Malaysia has been acting out of more incompetence than Vietnam. Says a lot doesn't it.

-----

 

Air Marshal Vinod Patni, a retired Indian air force officer and a defense expert, said radar facilities in the Andaman and Nicobar Islands area don?t work around the clock, either. ?These are generally switched on and off as and when required. A radar may be kept on for 24 hours on certain days. I won?t say that the Indian radars are highly sophisticated in the region,? he said.

Patni also said there are gaps in the coverage areas, including within the area being searched for the missing plane. He couldn?t give an exact location for specific gaps, but said pilots are well aware of them."

Read my post again please. Oh and also that is civilian radar. You can bet your ass military radar is kept on 24/7. No country that has military radar would go "hmm ok lets just turn it off at night".

If the plane did fly over Thailand in the middle of the night, it would have shown up on military radar. If Thailand really turns off all their radar systems at night then if China ever wanted to invade and bomb the #### out of Thailand they'd just do it at night and nobody would see them coming.

You also don't need a sophisticated radar system to detect a 777. It's a ######ing commercial plane with a radar cross section that's massive and a radar system that was made in 1960 would pick it up just fine. We aren't dealing with state of the art stealth fighters that require extremely advanced radar to detect.

[Praetor]

Read my post again please. Oh and also that is civilian radar. You can bet your ass military radar is kept on 24/7. No country that has military radar would go "hmm ok lets just turn it off at night".

 

only if they are going GREEN :laugh:

(sorry just to lighten things a little bit)

 

i'm pretty sure that somebody knows what happened to the airplane by now but they can't disclose to the public because of some motive. :/

[Mr. Gibs]

i'm pretty sure that somebody knows what happened to the airplane by now but they can't disclose to the public because of some motive. :/

That's definitely a possibility.

But in lighter news: http://i.imgur.com/AMnBgcn.png

As is usual with Craiglist, they claim its a 777-300 but it's a 777-200...sigh and I was just about to take out my checkbook

[kaffra]

Except THATS HOW INVESTIGATIONS ARE CONDUCTED.

They found a lead, they followed it, found it didn't pan out, moved on.

 

 

yes, thats what the malaysians are doing, but oh no China want hourly information and reports on what nobody has any information yet.

they have 10 satelites in the region

 

 

Uh huh read my first post.

China hasn't been constantly screwing up and denying claims and hiding information. They found a lead, followed it and then when nothing happened nothing happened. It's a giant ocean obviously everything they find won't be relevant but they still have to go look.

I also never said the Malaysians have to bow down to China but keep putting words in my mouth and defending what is increasingly looking like a throughly incompetent leadership from Malaysia.

 

That's pretty much what the countries have started doing after realizing how incompetent Malaysia is. China also joined the search well before the US did.

 

Malaysian PM did just say that the plane turned but the DCA said it was a deliberate hijacking. That's why the media pounced on the word hijacking, because thats how #### the major news networks are.

But take my example of the people on board.

First, two people with stolen passports. Then that became 4 people with stolen passports. Then that became 2 people with stolen passports who were Asian. Then that became 2 people who looked Italian. Then that became 5 people didn't board the plane and had their bags removed. Then that became 5 people did board the plane and their bags weren't removed. Explain that without using the word incompetence go on.

 

 

2 tickets were purchased with stolen passport information from south china airlines ticketing in thailand. 4 or 5 people were those that didnt board the plane or something like that, i dont know whats the actual story on the bags or those 5 people, i do know one passenger mistook the date and didnt board

 

---

You can blame Vietnam all you want, but here's the dirty truth. Vietnam has nothing to lose, it wasn't their plane, it wasn't their pilots, it wasn't their citizens, it wasn't their flag airline company and most likely the plane didn't even enter their water or their country. And yet they're helping out.

Malaysia? It was THEIR plane, pilots, crew, some passengers, their flag carrier, plane left their airport and was still on their radar screen when it disappeared. And yet Malaysia has been acting out of more incompetence than Vietnam. Says a lot doesn't it.

 

 

yes their plane disappeared as it was entering Vietnam space. its pretty unbelievable that with so many military activities in the region, neither malaysia, thailand, vietnam, US and china systems have any trace of the plane. i guess the chinese have to cover up their own blunder and shift all the blame elsewhere. even their 10 satellites found ####, and they have the balls to blame others.

 

China reaction is pretty contradictory to USA comment below,

 

Commander William Marks, who is spokesman for the United States Navy Seventh Fleet, credited the government for its well-organised action plan in coordinating the SAR efforts involving more than 10 countries

Read more: US Navy: Good job - General - New Straits Times http://www.nst.com.my/nation/general/us-navy-good-job-1.510104#ixzz2w5iG2UP2

 

Maybe this is their way to try and squeeze more information from malaysia and US efforts, which have been much more helpful and professional.

 

 

http://www.mirror.co.uk/news/world-news/missing-malaysia-airlines-flight-china-3228464

 

-----

 

Read my post again please. Oh and also that is civilian radar. You can bet your ass military radar is kept on 24/7. No country that has military radar would go "hmm ok lets just turn it off at night".

If the plane did fly over Thailand in the middle of the night, it would have shown up on military radar. If Thailand really turns off all their radar systems at night then if China ever wanted to invade and bomb the #### out of Thailand they'd just do it at night and nobody would see them coming.

You also don't need a sophisticated radar system to detect a 777. It's a ####ing commercial plane with a radar cross section that's massive and a radar system that was made in 1960 would pick it up just fine. We aren't dealing with state of the art stealth fighters that require extremely advanced radar to detect.

 

 

so where is it? If its so simple everybody would have seen it by now. the alleged diverted path would have been detected by thailand, india, indonesia, malaysia and probably the US/china fleets.

its likely theres a lot more going on behind the scenes, maybe for security reasons the chinese are not being briefed and this is why they are making the most noise

[Mr. Gibs]

yes, thats what the malaysians are doing, but oh no China want hourly information and reports on what nobody has any information yet.

they have 10 satelites in the region

Who said the chinese want that? Oh wait nobody.

 

http://www.nst.com.my/nation/general/us-navy-good-job-1.510104#ixzz2w5iG2UP2

This coming from the very same site that said another 777 talked to MH370 and made such a big deal about it. Surprising how no other site reported that or this right?

This also coming from the same commander who directed his fleet to another part of the ocean without the Malaysians telling him so. Yup definitely legit.

2 tickets were purchased with stolen passport information from south china airlines ticketing in thailand. 4 or 5 people were those that didnt board the plane or something like that, i dont know whats the actual story on the bags or those 5 people, i do know one passenger mistook the date and didnt board

Here's the breakdown (for the third time).

1. Malaysia informed us that 2 people had boarded the plane with a stolen passport.

2. Later they updated that quote to 4 people.

3. They then retracted the 4 people and said it was 2 people who were Asian and they were investigating.

4. Then they said 5 people didn't board the plane and Malaysia Airlines removed their baggage

5. Then they retracted the Asian features bit and claimed the 2 people with the stolen passports looked like an Italian Footballer.

6. Then they claimed that the 5 people who supposedly didn't board the plane and had their bags removed, actually did board the plane and no bags were removed.

7. Then they found out that the 2 people with stolen passports were Iranian and were most likely looking for asylum in Europe.

This all happened over a period of 4 days. They couldn't even get the fact that the 5 people who didn't board the plane were actually on board the plane right.

 

yes their plane disappeared as it was entering Vietnam space. its pretty unbelievable that with so many military activities in the region, neither malaysia, thailand, vietnam, US and china systems have any trace of the plane. i guess the chinese have to cover up their own blunder and shift all the blame elsewhere. even their 10 satellites found ####, and they have the balls to blame others.

Who said the chinese want to blame others? Oh wait nobody said that either. Oh and the plane never entered Vietnamese airspace, it disappeared before that.

 

Maybe this is their way to try and squeeze more information from malaysia and US efforts, which have been much more helpful and professional.

Sorry I wouldn't use the word professional to describe Malaysia.

 

so where is it? If its so simple everybody would have seen it by now. the alleged diverted path would have been detected by thailand, india, indonesia, malaysia and probably the US/china fleets.

its likely theres a lot more going on behind the scenes, maybe for security reasons the chinese are not being briefed and this is why they are making the most noise

Uh huh.

I love how your entire post revolves around BLAME CHINA FOR EVERYTHING, MALAYSIA CAN DO NO WRONG :rolleyes: And who mentioned anything about the Chinese? Oh wait nobody did either, until you brought it up. Every single person thinks the way this investigation has been handled has been a joke and reeks of incompetence, except for you. If it was the Chinese leading it, I would have said the same thing. If it was the Americans leading it, I would have said the same thing. But it's been the Malaysians leading it and guess what? I'll be saying the same thing.

Go back under your bridge and please for the love of ####ing god learn how to quote and stop blindly defending a country who couldn't even accurately let people know who was on THEIR airplane.

[jasondefaoite]

While I've been following the search since the beginning, I don't recall exactly what was an official release of information from Malaysia, and what was from "unnamed" sources which the press ran with.

 

However, two points stuck in my mind.

 

# The obvious one, how the hell does an unidentified plan (transponder off) cross back over peninsula Malaysia, is picked up by military radar, but nothing is done to attempt to ID the aircraft (radio call initially, then go from there). The fact the Americans were needed to help analyse the raw radar information answers the question i guess. Shows how incompetent the Malaysian military is.

 

# After the news that RR had engine data for an additional 4 hours was picked up by the media, the Malaysia transport minister said those reports were "inaccurate". The last communication from the plane was just before it disappeared from radar. Now, while technically true (there was no engine data), they must have already known by this stage some pings from the aircraft were returned and it did continue flying for at least 4 hours. They chose not to release this information to the public. I just wonder if they released it to the SAR partners.

[Hum]

^ There are often radar 'UFOs' -- unknown blips.

 

Those blips may be on the scope a minute or less.

 

Many operators in the various Eastern countries do little more than ask for voice ID.

 

They are very busy, and don't always launch fighter jets to chase after blips.

 

They might look foolish, and it could get expensive for smaller countries.

[dvb2000]

# The obvious one, how the hell does an unidentified plan (transponder off) cross back over peninsula Malaysia, is picked up by military radar, but nothing is done to attempt to ID the aircraft (radio call initially, then go from there). The fact the Americans were needed to help analyse the raw radar information answers the question i guess. Shows how incompetent the Malaysian military is.

 

 

Other than radio, which won't work because the military use different frequencies than Civilian, what do you suggest? Scramble a couple of F-22's to ID it?

[SuperJediMedia]

I am beginning to think maybe BOTH the pilot and some passengers are responsible for this. It is a planned hijack with many people in on it. People think it's just a couple people, but why not more? No facts against this consideration.

[Steven P. Administrators]

According to one paper in the UK at least, there are now fears of a 9/11 style attack.. but 8 days after it went missing??

[Hum]

^ I read days ago that Petronas Towers was possibly the terror target:

 

 

If the 777 made it to Iran, then I suspect the plane would be loaded with high explosives, and hit targets in Israel.

 

Iran may think, they couldn't be blamed, because it is not 'their' jet.

[Vykranth]

I am having a hard time believing the hijacking/terror attacks possibilities because I cannot find a valid motive and there have been so many stories and false leads that everything is confusing.

I am even thinking that the latest press conference of the Malaysian PM is a smoke screen to divert attention from their gross incompetence during last week.

 

Playing Devil's advocate, it has been 8 days since that aircraft vanished. One sure thing is that it is not flying: it is either under water, crashed or hidden on the ground.

 

Let's say it was hijacked. What for? to ransom the passengers? Who would do that? There are probably plenty of possibilities for mafias or criminal groups of easier ways to get crimes money: slaves trading, drug trafficking, sexual exploitation ...

And ransoms demands would have been made by now

 

Now, if the plane was hijacked to perform a 9/11 style terror attack, same question: who would do that and who would be the target? If the aircraft was flying west: let's say Afghanistan, Pakistan, Somalia, Iran. If that plane has landed and is being prepared to be used as a flying bomb, that would require that the aircraft is refuelled and refuelling a 777 requires jet fuel. You might not get that easily at the neighbourhood gas station.  That would require some associates, some complicity from the states. What would these states gain from doing such a terror attack?

Iran attacking Israel sounds completely far-fetched: first, Iran is trying to negotiate a deal regarding their nuclear program, doing such an attack is sure to jeopardize everything done so far. Besides, I am pretty that Israel airspace is monitored 24/7, an unknown unidentified aircraft flying towards an Israel city, the aircraft is intercepted in less than 2 minutes by F15 or shot down by Patriot missiles.

 

Someone might say that terrorists would put the passengers inside to prevent the aircraft from being shot down. That will not matter: in such scenarios where a plane is used as a flying bomb, the aircraft and all its occupants are considered as already lost. Bringing down is just avoiding more casualties on the ground.

 

This just does not make sense, Still, that aircraft has got to be somewhere. Hopefully, it will be found and a 'reasonable' explanation will be found

[ThisSiteHasLostItsCharm]

it's either crashed.

 

 

or landed at some remote location and kept quiet about.

 

 

you'd think with todays tech you could find a big passenger plane that's gone missing.

[Richteralan]

Now after one week of time, which Malaysia "borrowed" by obfuscating the rescue, they finally "started" to investigate the background pilot/co-pilot/crew.

 

I now believe it's about Malaysia's domestic power struggle, and Chinese population there apparently is the biggest voting group, hence a MA flight with majority of Chinese passengers.

[Praetor]

^ I read days ago that Petronas Towers was possibly the terror target:

 

 

If the 777 made it to Iran, then I suspect the plane would be loaded with high explosives, and hit targets in Israel.

 

Iran may think, they couldn't be blamed, because it is not 'their' jet.

 

then why use a airplane from such a faraway distance to do that? never mind that right now it's the 1? most wanted airplane in the world.

[Steven P. Administrators]

I think it's just unbelievable that the Malaysian government took a week to disclose that there were signals from the aircraft for up to 5 or 6 hours after it disappeared off radar. You'd think that information would have been known within the first 24 hours?

[FloatingFatMan]

I think it's just unbelievable that the Malaysian government took a week to disclose that there were signals from the aircraft for up to 5 or 6 hours after it disappeared off radar. You'd think that information would have been known within the first 24 hours?

 

Maybe it wasn't considered appropriate to release that information initially?

 

The public isn't always savvy to info as it becomes available, usually for very good reasons.

[Chris123NT]

I think it's just unbelievable that the Malaysian government took a week to disclose that there were signals from the aircraft for up to 5 or 6 hours after it disappeared off radar. You'd think that information would have been known within the first 24 hours?

I agree, just makes it seem like someone is trying to cover something up.

[Steven P. Administrators]

^ (y)

Maybe it wasn't considered appropriate to release that information initially?

 

The public isn't always savvy to info as it becomes available, usually for very good reasons.

Yeah but a full week later?

[xendrome]

^ I read days ago that Petronas Towers was possibly the terror target:

 

 

If the 777 made it to Iran, then I suspect the plane would be loaded with high explosives, and hit targets in Israel.

 

Iran may think, they couldn't be blamed, because it is not 'their' jet.

 

Lol if Iran wanted to attack Israel, they could just fire some of their short range missiles at them. There's no reason to go through an elaborate and risky plan to hijack a jet from another country. On top of that, I'm pretty sure Iran has passenger jets in their control also..

[Steven P. Administrators]

Lol if Iran wanted to attack Israel, they could just fire some of their short range missiles at them. There's no reason to go through an elaborate and risky plan to hijack a jet from another country. On top of that, I'm pretty sure Iran has passenger jets in their control also..

[FloatingFatMan]

^ (Y)

Yeah but a full week later?

 

Sure.  It could very well be critical information that could jeopardize an investigation.  Obviously, they no longer consider that the case now, but at first, it's quite possible they didn't want the responsible party to realise they were after them already.

 

Not saying that's the case, but it's not impossible.

[Mr. Gibs]

Other than radio, which won't work because the military use different frequencies than Civilian, what do you suggest? Scramble a couple of F-22's to ID it?

Um the military does have access to radios that operate on civilian frequencies...you can walk into any electronics store and buy them too.

And if there was an unidentified plane entering your countries airspace that had their transponder turned off what would you do? Pretty much any country with an airforce would have sent a couple of fighters to ID it.